Author Topic: Slightly Ghosted prints (tone on tone)  (Read 905 times)

Offline Dottonedan

Slightly Ghosted prints (tone on tone)
« on: January 02, 2019, 02:56:38 PM »
In each of a good process for printing very thin plastisol inks of white on dark heathers grey for example, to be a tone on tone. Slightly white, but the print obviously needs to be there without question, but faded enough to really look intentionally tone on tone and not just a light light mesh print of a 50/50.


In the past, I've worked at shops using 80% base and 20% pigment.  This did very well, but with todays Wilflex inks, I'm told there is something so different about them having to do with the phthalate/pvc free inks of today, that you can't use the same process or the 20% pigment washes off.


What are you guys using?
Artist & Sim Process separator, Co owner of The Shirt Board, Past M&R Digital tech installer for I-Image machines. Over 28 yrs in the apparel industry. Apparel sales, http://www.designsbydottone.com  e-mail [email protected] 615-821-7850


Offline Frog

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Re: Slightly Ghosted prints (tone on tone)
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2019, 03:04:42 PM »
I use my "universal gray yuck" which is the hodge-podge conglomeration of mis-mixes and leftovers. (interestingly, over the years it always seems to end up similar, a sort of really dark gray with a slight maroon cast).  A little of that into base, and it seems to work over all color shirts.
This is finished ink, mind you, and it may not even be 20%.
20% pigment seems like an awful lot!
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Offline aauusa

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Re: Slightly Ghosted prints (tone on tone)
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2019, 03:46:51 PM »
one stroke water color inks.  will work perfect for the worn faded tone on tone look

Offline Dottonedan

Re: Slightly Ghosted prints (tone on tone)
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2019, 08:28:31 PM »
Thanks to the both of you for the feedback. I say 20% pigment for the lack of a better explanation. I’m not versed in even the basic ink makeup other than to know plastisol from waterbase and the fact that I like thin inks. So I assume pigment is the color and base is the carrier.

back in the day, using Union Mix-Opaques, I would call out 10-15-20% base added depending on how much I needed then to blend. With that, we would use a ton more clear when doing a tone on tone and it was very good. Maybe they went 50/50 but we do that now and it’s still very white.
Artist & Sim Process separator, Co owner of The Shirt Board, Past M&R Digital tech installer for I-Image machines. Over 28 yrs in the apparel industry. Apparel sales, http://www.designsbydottone.com  e-mail [email protected] 615-821-7850

Offline Colin

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Re: Slightly Ghosted prints (tone on tone)
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2019, 09:49:21 PM »
Dan,

If I understood correctly - for vintage whites, I would add 10%-25% Fashion soft/Primer clear/Softee Base/watercolor/etc...  to your white ink of choice.

The last shop I was at, we did 10% Ultra Soft Primer Clear and whatever white I had laying around in 5's that I found to be lacking ;)  We would print through a 180s or 225s with an 80 duro blade.  Hard hard pressure and just enough speed to not drive it all the way into the garment - worked fantastically.  And was wash durable.

You talked about Pigment in the inks.... could you clarify that a little?  Are you wanting an opaque-ish color but a waterbase feel?
Been in the industry since 1996.  5+ years with QCM Inks.  Been a part of shops of all sizes and abilities both as a printer and as an Artist/separator.  I am now the Ink and Chemical Product Manager at Ryonet.

Offline Dottonedan

Re: Slightly Ghosted prints (tone on tone)
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2019, 10:39:09 PM »
I thought I had made a reply but must not have hit send.
When I refer to pigment, I'm saying that with no ink mixing education.  What I want, is as you described. A soft feel, a thing aged, worn look or ghosted look. I wasn't sure what the best additive was to thin it down enough to look good.

Back in the day, we referred to it as straight clear base. 10-20% to regular union Max-Opaque to make them blend for sim process well, but then we would add additional to do a really good ghosted image. Like you would see only maybe 30% of the black ink tone, and 70% shirt...but the coverage would be solid rather than halftone.  The actual mixture to get that, might have been in the 50% range.  When we use 50/50 now, with the inks we use, it's still too opaque. I'm told if we go any higher on the base, ti won't hold up in the wash.  NO?
50/50 white ink or 50/50 black ink is still too opaque. Too dark for the black tone, too white for the white tone.
Artist & Sim Process separator, Co owner of The Shirt Board, Past M&R Digital tech installer for I-Image machines. Over 28 yrs in the apparel industry. Apparel sales, http://www.designsbydottone.com  e-mail [email protected] 615-821-7850

Offline Colin

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Re: Slightly Ghosted prints (tone on tone)
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2019, 09:55:39 PM »
Dan,

What base are you using?

My assumption is that its a well balanced finished ink.  If that's the case, then you will never have cure issues, no matter what percentage you use.  Depending on the base used, you can have fiberlation issues after washing - and you are well aware of the variables in that.
Been in the industry since 1996.  5+ years with QCM Inks.  Been a part of shops of all sizes and abilities both as a printer and as an Artist/separator.  I am now the Ink and Chemical Product Manager at Ryonet.

Offline BP

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Re: Slightly Ghosted prints (tone on tone)
« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2019, 06:46:01 AM »
Dan, I used Wilflex for years and to get that look just add 40%-50% curable reducer to your white ink or colored ink.
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Offline Prince Art

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Re: Slightly Ghosted prints (tone on tone)
« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2019, 10:05:05 AM »
A curable reducer with a soft hand can essentially just be tinted with white, if you want to go really ghosty... and if fibrillation doesn't concern you. At least with the simple stuff we do, I don't regard mild fibrillation as a problem on prints that are supposed to look old & faded. In fact, I prep the customer to expect it when I sell the design. Happy customers thus far.
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Offline tonypep

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Re: Slightly Ghosted prints (tone on tone)
« Reply #9 on: January 25, 2019, 08:52:31 AM »
Important to note that pc whites vs curables matters much. IMO curables are a much better choice. It is not uncommon to have various ratios depending on graphic and/or substrate