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screen printing => Equipment => Topic started by: inkstain on June 13, 2018, 08:44:16 PM

Title: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: inkstain on June 13, 2018, 08:44:16 PM
Hi guys,

It's time for our semi-small shop to buy a new dryer.  We are a two person shop.  We currently run an M&R Diamondback S 7/8 using an Anatol Solutions Dryer which we've had for a long time and it's been giving us headaches for a while now.  It has a 5ft chamber with 30" infeed/outfeed.
Looking at the M&R Fusion 36-6-3 or 36-6-4.  Anyone here have one of those?  We're figuring going for the 4 panel one.  Would love to get the Radicure but that's out of our budget.  Any advice, pros or cons would be helpful. 
Thanks so much!
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: Colin on June 13, 2018, 08:55:58 PM
Gas.

The savings in electric will typically pay for the dryer :)

Other than that, do you run any waterbase type inks?
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: inkstain on June 13, 2018, 09:07:33 PM
Gas.

The savings in electric will typically pay for the dryer :)

Other than that, do you run any waterbase type inks?

Ugh.  I can't gas at my location, wish I could.
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: Rockers on June 13, 2018, 09:25:23 PM
Gas.

The savings in electric will typically pay for the dryer :)

Other than that, do you run any waterbase type inks?

Ugh.  I can't gas at my location, wish I could.
There is no gas line or you are not allowed to use any gas at all in your location. If there is no gas line just get a dryer that can run on propane, unless it is a lot more expensive then natural gas.
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: cbjamel on June 14, 2018, 12:57:50 AM
60-80amps ouch. make sure you can do it. monthly and in panel wise. 100am service probably not best. high bill monthly. look at propane cost vs electric cost.
shane

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: inkstain on June 14, 2018, 01:10:34 AM
Gas.

The savings in electric will typically pay for the dryer :)

Other than that, do you run any waterbase type inks?

Ugh.  I can't gas at my location, wish I could.
There is no gas line or you are not allowed to use any gas at all in your location. If there is no gas line just get a dryer that can run on propane, unless it is a lot more expensive then natural gas.

Now you got me thinking.  Do you run gas?  Aren't Gas dryers waaaay more expensive in initial cost?
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: inkstain on June 14, 2018, 01:13:03 AM
60-80amps ouch. make sure you can do it. monthly and in panel wise. 100am service probably not best. high bill monthly. look at propane cost vs electric cost.
shane

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

I'm running about 51 amps for my dryer now.  If I go the 4 panel route it'll be about 76-83 amps.  Yeah, doesn't sound good but aren't gas dryers super expensive?
I live in Hawaii so I don't know about gas/propane pricing.  Need to look into it.  Do you run a gas dryer?  If so, what dryer?  Thanks
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: Rockers on June 14, 2018, 06:45:13 AM
Gas.

The savings in electric will typically pay for the dryer :)

Other than that, do you run any waterbase type inks?



Ugh.  I can't gas at my location, wish I could.
There is no gas line or you are not allowed to use any gas at all in your location. If there is no gas line just get a dryer that can run on propane, unless it is a lot more expensive then natural gas.

Now you got me thinking.  Do you run gas?  Aren't Gas dryers waaaay more expensive in initial cost?
The dryer wasn`t cheap but electricity is crazy expensive here.  Gas on the other hand is fairly cheap which made the decision even easier.
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: mk162 on June 14, 2018, 08:34:55 AM
It was a few years back but our 48" Interchange with an extra infeed and outfeed was right around $20k.  I have performed one repair on it in 9 years and we do less than half the recommended maintenance.  I would buy another in a heartbeat.

I would personally talk to Winston before I jumped on any gas dryer.  He will give you the weak points of each brand/model.

I would do everything in my power to never own another electric dryer. Ours became nothing but problems at the end, and the few hundred dollars I save a month adds up fast.
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: mimosatexas on June 14, 2018, 08:53:16 AM
The interchange is 3 phase right? I did a bunch of this research last month and the mini sprint and heatwave seemed like the best options, especially since neither requires 3 phase and there are a bunch of them on the used market compared to other options. Pricing was around 10 to 15k used
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: cbjamel on June 14, 2018, 08:55:35 AM
I have mini sprint. there was some used ones in Cali for sale.

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Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: Stinkhorn Press on June 14, 2018, 08:56:30 AM
It was a few years back but our 48" Interchange with an extra infeed and outfeed was right around $20k.  I have performed one repair on it in 9 years and we do less than half the recommended maintenance.  I would buy another in a heartbeat.

I would personally talk to Winston before I jumped on any gas dryer.  He will give you the weak points of each brand/model.

I would do everything in my power to never own another electric dryer. Ours became nothing but problems at the end, and the few hundred dollars I save a month adds up fast.

this.
never ever electric dryer. a bad inefficient problematic semi-solution that often struggles to get proper cure. ask me if i like electric dryers.
there are several decent gas dryer makers. i have an old precision vortex. took us a bit of hassle to figure out that some dumbass had installed the butterfly valve backwards, but after sorting that, it's been a dream. some months i pay more for my water cooler water supply than I do for the gas itself.
and winston. good guy. knows his stuff. has firm opinions on brands and makes/models, but has earned the right to those opinions.
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: mk162 on June 14, 2018, 09:18:17 AM
The interchange is 3 phase right? I did a bunch of this research last month and the mini sprint and heatwave seemed like the best options, especially since neither requires 3 phase and there are a bunch of them on the used market compared to other options. Pricing was around 10 to 15k used

I am sure you can get it single phase, a phase converter would work as well.  It only draws 10A I think, so it's not a ton of lo

Why are there a bunch on the used market?  I always ask myself that with woodworking tools...
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: whitewater on June 14, 2018, 11:46:51 AM
We have a fusion... only reason we did not buy a gas dryer was because before we moved our last shop was way to small.

Prob in a year or 2 the savings in electricity would pay for it.

I would like to switch to gas now now..but the whole crating and selling the fusion is daunting..LOL
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: Nation03 on June 14, 2018, 12:19:06 PM
Is it universal to all States that a gas dryer will 100% save you money? I know a comparable electric dryer in terms of dozen/hour would draw a lot of amps, but will I see much of a difference in my utlitiy costs if I went from a 28 amp electric dryer to, lets say, a used mini sprint or heatwave that pulls about 15 amps?
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: mimosatexas on June 14, 2018, 12:40:24 PM
The interchange is 3 phase right? I did a bunch of this research last month and the mini sprint and heatwave seemed like the best options, especially since neither requires 3 phase and there are a bunch of them on the used market compared to other options. Pricing was around 10 to 15k used

I am sure you can get it single phase, a phase converter would work as well.  It only draws 10A I think, so it's not a ton of lo

Why are there a bunch on the used market?  I always ask myself that with woodworking tools...

Only bring it up so it isnt a surprise (it was to me when we looked at options that would fit our space).  Phase converter is an option, though an added cost.

I'd imagine there are more of the M&R dryers just because they initially sold more than other brands.  By a bunch I mean maybe half a dozen at a time across the country vs 1 or none like many others.  Just not a lot of used dryer inventory from what I've seen, unlike presses. I havent heard any complaints really from shops that still run either of them.
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: inkstain on June 14, 2018, 01:56:31 PM
The interchange is 3 phase right? I did a bunch of this research last month and the mini sprint and heatwave seemed like the best options, especially since neither requires 3 phase and there are a bunch of them on the used market compared to other options. Pricing was around 10 to 15k used

I am sure you can get it single phase, a phase converter would work as well.  It only draws 10A I think, so it's not a ton of lo

Why are there a bunch on the used market?  I always ask myself that with woodworking tools...

Thanks for the info.  How do I get a hold of Winston?
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: californiadreamin on June 14, 2018, 02:05:47 PM
The interchange is 3 phase right? I did a bunch of this research last month and the mini sprint and heatwave seemed like the best options, especially since neither requires 3 phase and there are a bunch of them on the used market compared to other options. Pricing was around 10 to 15k used

I am sure you can get it single phase, a phase converter would work as well.  It only draws 10A I think, so it's not a ton of lo

Why are there a bunch on the used market?  I always ask myself that with woodworking tools...

Thanks for the info.  How do I get a hold of Winston?

Give Me A Shout To Discuss Your Needs, Budget, Best Options
I have a few customers using  gas dryers in Hawaii!
Winston
904.3430848
winstric@yahoo.com
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: screenxpress on June 14, 2018, 03:05:49 PM
I have 2 cents to add for propane and nothing for the dryer.

I recently helped my brother put in a propane hot water heater in the country.  No Natural gas is available.

Imagine my surprise when I found out he used up 90 gallons (from a 150 gal tank) in just 2.5 months and the only device on propane is the hot water heater.  I've found out that a propane hot water heater uses about 1 - 1.5 gallons a day at $2.25/gallon.

The hot water heater only cycles to maintain a heated temperature.  I can only imagine how much propane would be used up by a constant running dryer for 8 hours......Yikes.
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: Sbrem on June 14, 2018, 05:15:42 PM
Gas.

The savings in electric will typically pay for the dryer :)

Other than that, do you run any waterbase type inks?



Ugh.  I can't gas at my location, wish I could.
There is no gas line or you are not allowed to use any gas at all in your location. If there is no gas line just get a dryer that can run on propane, unless it is a lot more expensive then natural gas.

Now you got me thinking.  Do you run gas?  Aren't Gas dryers waaaay more expensive in initial cost?
The dryer wasn`t cheap but electricity is crazy expensive here.  Gas on the other hand is fairly cheap which made the decision even easier.

We put in an Interchange MD8 a couple of months ago, all gas, 28K plus installation of the gas lines from a plumber. A great dryer, and I've seen a few over 40 years.

steve
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: Rockers on June 14, 2018, 08:25:44 PM
I have 2 cents to add for propane and nothing for the dryer.

I recently helped my brother put in a propane hot water heater in the country.  No Natural gas is available.

Imagine my surprise when I found out he used up 90 gallons (from a 150 gal tank) in just 2.5 months and the only device on propane is the hot water heater.  I've found out that a propane hot water heater uses about 1 - 1.5 gallons a day at $2.25/gallon.

The hot water heater only cycles to maintain a heated temperature.  I can only imagine how much propane would be used up by a constant running dryer for 8 hours......Yikes.

Our dryer, 3 m heat chamber, 1.30 m belt width, can run at 338F for 60 hours on a 100 pound propane gas bottle.
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: Biverson on June 14, 2018, 10:02:42 PM
I have 2 cents to add for propane and nothing for the dryer.

I recently helped my brother put in a propane hot water heater in the country.  No Natural gas is available.

Imagine my surprise when I found out he used up 90 gallons (from a 150 gal tank) in just 2.5 months and the only device on propane is the hot water heater.  I've found out that a propane hot water heater uses about 1 - 1.5 gallons a day at $2.25/gallon.

The hot water heater only cycles to maintain a heated temperature.  I can only imagine how much propane would be used up by a constant running dryer for 8 hours......Yikes.

Our dryer, 3 m heat chamber, 1.30 m belt width, can run at 338F for 60 hours on a 100 pound propane gas bottle.

A 100lbs tank? One that's about 4 ft. High and a foot wide. I use one to heat my shop and had to fill it once a week. Cost around $65 each fill, $90 at one place. So it's be around $180-$200/mo In propane? Is that good or bad compared to natural? I've got an Econored II that's 35 amps. I haven't noticed a crazy jump in electrical since I started, but I imagine if you get a 8' IR chamber that's going to be a lot more. Just asking about efficiency and price because I'm land locked for space and can't get natural gas or 3 phase in my current location.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: Rockers on June 14, 2018, 11:49:39 PM
I have 2 cents to add for propane and nothing for the dryer.

I recently helped my brother put in a propane hot water heater in the country.  No Natural gas is available.

Imagine my surprise when I found out he used up 90 gallons (from a 150 gal tank) in just 2.5 months and the only device on propane is the hot water heater.  I've found out that a propane hot water heater uses about 1 - 1.5 gallons a day at $2.25/gallon.

The hot water heater only cycles to maintain a heated temperature.  I can only imagine how much propane would be used up by a constant running dryer for 8 hours......Yikes.

Our dryer, 3 m heat chamber, 1.30 m belt width, can run at 338F for 60 hours on a 100 pound propane gas bottle.

A 100lbs tank? One that's about 4 ft. High and a foot wide. I use one to heat my shop and had to fill it once a week. Cost around $65 each fill, $90 at one place. So it's be around $180-$200/mo In propane? Is that good or bad compared to natural? I've got an Econored II that's 35 amps. I haven't noticed a crazy jump in electrical since I started, but I imagine if you get a 8' IR chamber that's going to be a lot more. Just asking about efficiency and price because I'm land locked for space and can't get natural gas or 3 phase in my current location.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Not sure if that is good or bad in the US but here in Japan it`s more expensive then natural gas but still cheaper the electricity. We run for on natural gas now for a while. Burner can be adjusted to your needs.
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: Sbrem on June 15, 2018, 10:51:08 AM
I have 2 cents to add for propane and nothing for the dryer.

I recently helped my brother put in a propane hot water heater in the country.  No Natural gas is available.

Imagine my surprise when I found out he used up 90 gallons (from a 150 gal tank) in just 2.5 months and the only device on propane is the hot water heater.  I've found out that a propane hot water heater uses about 1 - 1.5 gallons a day at $2.25/gallon.

The hot water heater only cycles to maintain a heated temperature.  I can only imagine how much propane would be used up by a constant running dryer for 8 hours......Yikes.

Our dryer, 3 m heat chamber, 1.30 m belt width, can run at 338F for 60 hours on a 100 pound propane gas bottle.

A 100lbs tank? One that's about 4 ft. High and a foot wide. I use one to heat my shop and had to fill it once a week. Cost around $65 each fill, $90 at one place. So it's be around $180-$200/mo In propane? Is that good or bad compared to natural? I've got an Econored II that's 35 amps. I haven't noticed a crazy jump in electrical since I started, but I imagine if you get a 8' IR chamber that's going to be a lot more. Just asking about efficiency and price because I'm land locked for space and can't get natural gas or 3 phase in my current location.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you can't get gas or 3 phase in your area, then to go gas, you'll need propane, or of course, pay a fortune in electricity. At one time, we were averaging 2500 a month, consider that.

Steve
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: Biverson on June 15, 2018, 12:39:39 PM

A 100lbs tank? One that's about 4 ft. High and a foot wide. I use one to heat my shop and had to fill it once a week. Cost around $65 each fill, $90 at one place. So it's be around $180-$200/mo In propane? Is that good or bad compared to natural? I've got an Econored II that's 35 amps. I haven't noticed a crazy jump in electrical since I started, but I imagine if you get a 8' IR chamber that's going to be a lot more. Just asking about efficiency and price because I'm land locked for space and can't get natural gas or 3 phase in my current location.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you can't get gas or 3 phase in your area, then to go gas, you'll need propane, or of course, pay a fortune in electricity. At one time, we were averaging 2500 a month, consider that.

Steve

Holy smokes! This is what I was wondering. $2500/mo. is insane. A couple hundred a month in propane is a no brainer - not to mention the more consistent cures and faster production.
Title: Re: Time to buy a new Dryer. Need advice.
Post by: Sbrem on June 15, 2018, 04:16:24 PM

A 100lbs tank? One that's about 4 ft. High and a foot wide. I use one to heat my shop and had to fill it once a week. Cost around $65 each fill, $90 at one place. So it's be around $180-$200/mo In propane? Is that good or bad compared to natural? I've got an Econored II that's 35 amps. I haven't noticed a crazy jump in electrical since I started, but I imagine if you get a 8' IR chamber that's going to be a lot more. Just asking about efficiency and price because I'm land locked for space and can't get natural gas or 3 phase in my current location.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you can't get gas or 3 phase in your area, then to go gas, you'll need propane, or of course, pay a fortune in electricity. At one time, we were averaging 2500 a month, consider that.

Steve

Holy smokes! This is what I was wondering. $2500/mo. is insane. A couple hundred a month in propane is a no brainer - not to mention the more consistent cures and faster production.

At the time, a 60" and 48" all infrared, plus another 24". We were able to swap out the big with a pair of Advance Tex-Air, which were hybrids, and the electric bill went down to the 1600 neighbor hood, and about 400 for gas. Since our move, our new landlord didn't want us to put our own meters in, so they'll do a comparison after 6 months or so, and have a sit down with us. They have been very good to us so far...

Steve