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screen printing => Screen Making => Topic started by: richard@national on October 10, 2017, 06:12:40 PM

Title: No Tape Screens
Post by: richard@national on October 10, 2017, 06:12:40 PM
Does it really help or do you still tape the inside?
How does the block out hold up?
Do you spend more time in reclaim and cleanup?

I understand the idea of saving tape cost and screen prep time.
But I want some real feed back on if it really helps or if it's just a FAD!!!
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: Homer on October 10, 2017, 07:34:18 PM
haven't used tape in a few years. we only block out on long wb runs. tape is wasteful and spawn of the devil. no fad here....
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: Rockers on October 10, 2017, 08:47:57 PM
I`m actually more interested if anyone tapes up the area where the mesh has been glued to the frame. I constantly get mesh "curling" up at the outer edge of the frame. After a few weeks of continued use the mesh has "peeled" off the frame by at least 1 cm.
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: richard@national on October 10, 2017, 09:46:17 PM
New frames or re-meshed frames?
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: ericheartsu on October 10, 2017, 09:47:20 PM
I hate tape so much. We had a GREAT run where we only needed to put tape at the very top of the screen where the squeegee/flood bar landed, but i'm not sure when it changed, but we are back to doing full inner taping.
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: kingscreen on October 10, 2017, 11:07:07 PM
No personal experience.  But from what I’ve been told, if you use a dip tank the permanent block out wears out quickly. I’m not sure I would trust it.
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: mimosatexas on October 11, 2017, 01:07:13 AM
I cant handle the spray back from the pressure washer when the glue overlaps the frame.  Everything gets caught in there as well, ink, emulsion, chemicals.  Rinsing the screens is a bitch.  Tape is simple, quick, and have no reclaim related issues (unless you use crap tape).
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: mk162 on October 11, 2017, 08:35:07 AM
take out the time it takes to tape and untape a screen, plus the cost of the tape...and Im not talking $60 a year.  Our screen tape is around $5 a roll or so.  It's several hundred dollars per year for us in tape, and take out labor, it's a huge savings here.

I hate tape.  We don't use blockout, we just us a wider coater and make sure we go all the way to the edges on the top and bottom of the frames.
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: richard@national on October 11, 2017, 11:05:39 AM
Thanks for the feed back.
I have used them in the past and was riding the fence back then.
But now that I am re-meshing frames as a business. I just want to make sure what I am offering as no tape screens is really helpful and is going to hold up long term. I do not want to sell someone a product that eventually leads to a bad exp.
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: Stinkhorn Press on October 11, 2017, 11:27:56 AM
I cant handle the spray back from the pressure washer when the glue overlaps the frame.  Everything gets caught in there as well, ink, emulsion, chemicals.  Rinsing the screens is a bitch.  Tape is simple, quick, and have no reclaim related issues (unless you use crap tape).

Block U not block O. leave the "bottom" edge open.
Still get sprayback, but you leave an exit for ink and chemicals and water while reclaiming/rinsing.
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: Nation03 on October 11, 2017, 03:46:31 PM
I still use tape on the tapeless screens. I get the tapeless ones because I like to think its extra protection against tears near the frame. Think my power washer might be to strong because I'm getting way to many holes in these s-threads. Might just start reclaiming them with a garden hose.
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: screenxpress on October 11, 2017, 06:07:02 PM
haven't used tape in a few years. we only block out on long wb runs.

That poses a question.  The block out I have always used is water soluble.  If yours is the same, doesn't the wb ink start to dissolve it? 

Same question of the effect on water soluble block out on screens to be used for discharge printing?
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: Homer on October 11, 2017, 07:33:05 PM
haven't used tape in a few years. we only block out on long wb runs.

That poses a question.  The block out I have always used is water soluble.  If yours is the same, doesn't the wb ink start to dissolve it? 

Same question of the effect on water soluble block out on screens to be used for discharge printing?

we actually use emulsion for block out when we do it. it resolves so much easier than that purple CCI waterbase blockout. We simply set the screen in the sun or back on the starlight and bob's your uncle.
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: screenxpress on October 11, 2017, 10:57:26 PM
Thank you Uncle Bob

One more question though.  You find a pin hole, you dab it with emulsion.  I follow the sun thing for quick expose, but the emulsion is wet.  Do you hit it with a heat gun or something to quick dry before the sun?  Or does the sun do both the quick dry and quick expose job?
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: Homer on October 12, 2017, 05:25:05 AM
Thank you Uncle Bob

One more question though.  You find a pin hole, you dab it with emulsion.  I follow the sun thing for quick expose, but the emulsion is wet.  Do you hit it with a heat gun or something to quick dry before the sun?  Or does the sun do both the quick dry and quick expose job?

what's this pin hole business you speak of?.....very rare to have those, i think they tag it with a piece of masking tape. but with dts and no glass, that's really a nonissue...and really clean screens...
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: IntegrityShirts on October 12, 2017, 08:54:14 AM
I cant handle the spray back from the pressure washer when the glue overlaps the frame.  Everything gets caught in there as well, ink, emulsion, chemicals.  Rinsing the screens is a bitch.  Tape is simple, quick, and have no reclaim related issues (unless you use crap tape).

I bought one of these shorty pressure washer wands specifically to solve the spray back problem. With this short wand you can hold it up high and spray DOWN at an angle on the frames to lessen the backspray. Now, I use a small pressure washer, nothing too crazy powerful, so your results may vary. The only drawback I have found with this wand is you, in general, get a little wetter reclaiming screens because you're closer to the action lol.

https://www.amazon.com/DUSICHIN-DUS-220-Pressure-Washer-Nozzles/dp/B0157U65MO/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1507812640&sr=8-14&keywords=pressure+washer+wand (https://www.amazon.com/DUSICHIN-DUS-220-Pressure-Washer-Nozzles/dp/B0157U65MO/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1507812640&sr=8-14&keywords=pressure+washer+wand)
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: Prince Art on October 12, 2017, 10:02:59 AM
I cant handle the spray back from the pressure washer when the glue overlaps the frame.  Everything gets caught in there as well, ink, emulsion, chemicals.  Rinsing the screens is a bitch.  Tape is simple, quick, and have no reclaim related issues (unless you use crap tape).

I bought one of these shorty pressure washer wands specifically to solve the spray back problem. With this short wand you can hold it up high and spray DOWN at an angle on the frames to lessen the backspray. Now, I use a small pressure washer, nothing too crazy powerful, so your results may vary. The only drawback I have found with this wand is you, in general, get a little wetter reclaiming screens because you're closer to the action lol.

https://www.amazon.com/DUSICHIN-DUS-220-Pressure-Washer-Nozzles/dp/B0157U65MO/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1507812640&sr=8-14&keywords=pressure+washer+wand (https://www.amazon.com/DUSICHIN-DUS-220-Pressure-Washer-Nozzles/dp/B0157U65MO/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1507812640&sr=8-14&keywords=pressure+washer+wand)

I've wondered if there's a wand out there with an angled end that could be used to accomplish the same thing, but from farther away. I haven't used tapeless screens, but minimizing backspray would be good during reclaim regardless. I confess I haven't shopped around much to find such a wand, though.
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: screenxpress on October 12, 2017, 01:20:40 PM
what's this pin hole business you speak of?.....very rare to have those, i think they tag it with a piece of masking tape. but with dts and no glass, that's really a nonissue...and really clean screens...

I am also getting them extremely rare.  But with starting some discharge testing, the thought had come to me about the suspected non-value using water based fillers.  And my DTS is Armstrong  ;)
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: RICK STEFANICK on October 12, 2017, 02:34:16 PM
We like the no tape screens but still tape some. Yes they do leak after a while. Richard THANKS for the great job on the last 80 you did besides the huge savings.
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: Logoman on November 26, 2017, 10:03:04 AM
Anybody have pics of a screen using Blockout without tape and being used on the press?
Title: Re: No Tape Screens
Post by: screenxpress on November 26, 2017, 04:38:20 PM
Been there, done that.

I just recently reclaimed a bunch of old wooden screens from over 10 years back that still had full blockout where I now use tape.  Wish I had taken a picture before removing and giving them away.  The waterbase blockout did the job but took forever to wash out before I could remove the emulsion. 

I stopped doing that years ago.

I've got most of a gallon of blue Blockout I'll let go super cheap!

===========================
Update-

I went digging around in the old boxes and came up with these....per your inquiry.  One using Blue and one using Red.  These were saved screens going back to my first print days and were what got me started in this in the first place....my son's band, lol.