Author Topic: titanium needles  (Read 3590 times)

Offline balloonguy

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titanium needles
« on: August 12, 2022, 03:08:49 PM »
I am running some structured caps and I am breaking a lot of needles. I am looking for a better solution. Do the titanium really hold up better? Silicone spray? What size should I be using?
Thanks. I am new to embroidery sorry for all the questions.
When you dig grave will you make it shallow so that I can feel the rain?


Offline Zelko-4-EVA

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Re: titanium needles
« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2022, 08:42:46 PM »
what needle are you using right now?

i think we use regular sharp needles 75/11, and at a slower speed maybe 650 or so.

hows your hook timing and distance from needle?  might need to increase the distance a hair if the needle is getting pushed into the hook...  tension on top thread?   the structure plus backing stabilizer can add a bit of resistance to the thread, if you back off a tiny bit it might help...

im not a pro at embroidery, but these are things that techs have asked me to check when ive asked them similar questions.

Offline mooseman

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Re: titanium needles
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2022, 12:13:44 PM »
I am running some structured caps and I am breaking a lot of needles. I am looking for a better solution. Do the titanium really hold up better? Silicone spray? What size should I be using?
Thanks. I am new to embroidery sorry for all the questions.

Traditional problem when working structured caps.
There is a bunch of ares at consider;

1 HOOPING is your first focus. If you are getting any flagging (movement of the cap down from needle pressure because it rides above the needle plate). The cap needs to be riding over the needil plate or as close as possible, ideally right on the plate to mitigate this issue.
Most machines will have a different style needle plate for caps and flats. The cap plates are generally taller (higher).

A rube Goldberg fix.....We used to take a strip of plastic like the plastic you cut from real cheap flimsey school folders. The plastic is flexible and very slippery. Cut, fit, open a hole to comfortably clear needle and thread, lay over you needle plate and hold doen with electrical tape wrapped over the top of the piece.
POSSIBLE FIX....work on your hooping

THIS COULD BE A BIG HELP...if you have a cap press press the cap first to even up and soften the buckrum.
Structured caps are simply a PITA. The buckrums present multiple curves to the machine from one side to the other, top to bottom, and especially across the center seam. the cap to needle plate distance is constantly changing as the desigh sews across the cap.....PITA.

Buy good hoops there are two general types that come standard with common machines, 270 degree frames and wide cap frames pics below. EMS HOOPTECK make some nice cap frames but bring your checkbook  https://www.hooptechproducts.com/cap-frames/

2 the cap style has a bunch to do with it. The thickness of the buckrum , stiffness of the buckrum even the weave of the buckrum is a factor, example buckrum weave like screen mesh... a 120 mesh print screen vs a 230 mesh print screen so to speak.
Sometimes it is more the cap style and construction than anything else.

Use 75-11 needles and SLOW DOWN YOUR MACHINE, the videos we see of some machine sewing caps at 800- 1000 RPM is BULL SQUIRT.
It doesent happen in our world.
Turn your needle about 3-5 degrees to the right when you are looking straight at the needle at the front of the machine.Normally we set the long groove of the needle straight forward but the thread actually rides  down to the needle slightly offset to the right. This will help the thread path through the needle.

DIGITIZING IS BIG PLUS OR MINUS ..........
Cap designs are digitized real differently that flat designs. You generally cant pull a Dakota Collectibles motorcycle design generally designed for flats and throw it on a cap and get good results. There are exceptions but you have to have a whole bunch og the other factors going your way.

Thread...Polyester thread thread is far better than Rayon thread when it comes to caps.
We used initially Isocord brand and switched to Maderia. Isocord was a problem generally because the poly core was so strong the outer poly thread form would frizz away but the machime would keep running on the thread core stiching away a mess that was a nightmare to clean up.

At the end of it all there is one basic cosmic element about embroidered caps there are those in the universe that do them well and then there are those that simply cant get it right...WE were in the can't get it right group and stopped taking orders for STRUCTURED cap initially and then just caps in general.
Hope some of this drool helps .
mooseman
DUE TO CIRCUMSTANCES COMPLETELY WITHIN MY CONTROL YOU SHOULD GET YOUR OWN TEE SHIRT AND A SHARPIE MARKER BY NOON TOMORROW OR SIMPLY CALL SOMEONE WHO GIVES A SHIRT.

Offline mk162

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Re: titanium needles
« Reply #3 on: August 16, 2022, 10:03:13 AM »
All the info above is fantastic.  Hats can be a problem.  I will say that out Barudan knocks them out.  On our other machine, hats were the worst.  I enjoy running them now...except when I do a ton and my thumbs hurt from loading them.  We do not do puff, I have enough on my plate without worrying about that.

You may need to upsize your needle to an 80/12 to get less deflection on a constructed hat.  Also, you can spray them with some dry silicone after hooping to allow the needle to slide through easier.

« Last Edit: August 16, 2022, 01:04:33 PM by mk162 »

Offline balloonguy

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Re: titanium needles
« Reply #4 on: August 16, 2022, 11:04:33 AM »
Thank you for the replies. I will check my needles. I have 75/11 and 80/12. I am not sure what they are made of though. They are Groz-Beckert brand. From reading the posts I am sure that there is too much room between the hat and the needle plate. I can see the hat flexing during sewing. I will look at adjusting that and softening the hats some. Do you spray the needle itself with dry silicone or does that go on the hat?
Thanks again for all the help.
Matt
When you dig grave will you make it shallow so that I can feel the rain?

Offline mk162

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Re: titanium needles
« Reply #5 on: August 16, 2022, 01:06:46 PM »
Thank you for the replies. I will check my needles. I have 75/11 and 80/12. I am not sure what they are made of though. They are Groz-Beckert brand. From reading the posts I am sure that there is too much room between the hat and the needle plate. I can see the hat flexing during sewing. I will look at adjusting that and softening the hats some. Do you spray the needle itself with dry silicone or does that go on the hat?
Thanks again for all the help.
Matt

I changed my reply to 80/12 because I realized I think I'm wrong on the sizes.  Just go up one size.  You will get some movement between the hat and the needle plate.  Hats don't lay flat on the plate.

Spray the silicone on the hat.  it doesn't need a ton, it just helps the needle and thread slide through the fabric.  I will sometimes spray the buckram on the inside of heavier hats.

Offline balloonguy

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Re: titanium needles
« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2022, 01:12:45 PM »
I am running 500 stitches per minute. I will try the silicone spray too. I looked online and it looks like the titanium needles have a gold finish. I am ordering some today.
Thanks for all the help. I truly appreciate it!
When you dig grave will you make it shallow so that I can feel the rain?

Offline mk162

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Re: titanium needles
« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2022, 01:17:20 PM »
I am running 500 stitches per minute. I will try the silicone spray too. I looked online and it looks like the titanium needles have a gold finish. I am ordering some today.
Thanks for all the help. I truly appreciate it!

good luck.  what brand machine do you have?  Make sure to offset your needles slightly to the right like moose said.

Offline balloonguy

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Re: titanium needles
« Reply #8 on: August 16, 2022, 07:12:16 PM »
I have an avance 1501c from coldesi. I think it is a fair quality machine. They do have AWESOME tech support (at least on other stuff I bought from them) so I felt like I would get the needed help from them. They have been good with mechanical support but I don't think they have real world experience like you guys do.
I did get try the silicone and rotating the needle a little bit. So far it has been running much better. I still had a couple of thread breaks but not needles.
Thanks again for all the help.
When you dig grave will you make it shallow so that I can feel the rain?