Author Topic: Advantages of open area vs tight mesh and mesh thicknes  (Read 4396 times)

Offline blue moon

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Advantages of open area vs tight mesh and mesh thicknes
« on: May 25, 2011, 01:19:40 PM »
So I am playing with the new LX mesh. It is knuckless and thus very thin 180. This has very large open areas and is printing the 25% 55lpi rather nicely. I have not tried anything lower yet.

What is the actual science behind optimal mesh selection? If I can get the wide open space of the low tension 180LX, why should I or shouldn't use the 230? Does that open area trump the tight screens? I think it does, but the question is how much?
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Offline yorkie

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Re: Advantages of open area vs tight mesh and mesh thicknes
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2011, 04:07:02 PM »
While the open screen sounds like it has less tension, how well does that tension stay maintain?

Any issue with wear or breakage of the mesh verses standard mesh?


Offline ZooCity

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Re: Advantages of open area vs tight mesh and mesh thicknes
« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2011, 04:27:47 PM »
Not a scientific perspective, but I like both.  That is, some jobs work better, imho, with high tension mesh and the subsequently thicker threads and some are best ran with the thinner threads at lower tension.  Specifically, large, solid fill open areas with thick inks are not S meshes strong point. 

S mesh, or any thin thread mesh I'm sure, does tend to get damaged more easily.  So far I've been very impressed with the S mesh's ability to hold stable tension.  Properly stretched the first time around, the upkeep is minimal just as it is with the Newman Roller Mesh or, presumably any quality, low-elongation mesh. 

A good example was a job on Gildan hoodies I ran two days ago. Black fleece with a pretty big open area print on the back, white ink.  Used a 150s with a lot of eom, about as much as the art could still resolve at.  With a little warming and stirring, the Epic Quick White was flowing like butter.  Had to jack the off contact up ridiculously high and still had issues with snap off.  Prints looked fine, but my discerning eye didn't care for the way the ink surface looked up close and repeatability was much more difficult at such high oc and lower tension (I print manually).  The trade off is that the same job, ran on the newman mesh at 50-55 n/cm would have had a much more even surface but, up close, you can see the mesh threads pattern just a bit. 

I do enjoy the reduced drag of thin thread mesh and, as a hand printer, using fast strokes with less pressure. 

How do you like the LX compared to regular 'ol S Pierre?  I'm looking forward to trying some.  Not a fan of white mesh threads though....I'm guessing that's why it only comes in the lower counts. 

Offline DouglasGrigar

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Re: Advantages of open area vs tight mesh and mesh thicknes
« Reply #3 on: May 26, 2011, 04:14:56 PM »
While the open screen sounds like it has less tension, how well does that tension stay maintain?

While the threads are thinner, the properties of the materials stay the same... Also in development is a “dual material” thread in the works with more exotic thread materials than just polyester monofilament, the outside as I understand is similar to mono poly but inside is the exotic material increasing the strength.

On standard mono poly the ability to stabilize after tensioning is the same but at lower levels.

The ability to hold details in the print are astounding and far greater than the thick threads.

Quote
Any issue with wear or breakage of the mesh verses standard mesh?

The above concerns are logical and reasonable and follow what you would expect from a thinner thread.

Thin threads were never a “secret” but the most resistance is often in the camp that has the most to gain by selling high-tension capable thick thread mesh and promoting highest tensions.

I was hit on this on line about 6 years ago on line by a dealer whoring for a particular product when I pointed out that thin thread meshes by the very nature of the product will allow better ink flow and promote the printed resolution of details and by default hold higher detail. You would have thought I was talking about killing fuzzy bunnies with a baseball bat daring to infringe on the cult of super high tension... :o
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Offline yorkie

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Re: Advantages of open area vs tight mesh and mesh thicknes
« Reply #4 on: May 26, 2011, 04:30:20 PM »
I was hit on this on line about 6 years ago on line by a dealer whoring for a particular product when I pointed out that thin thread meshes by the very nature of the product will allow better ink flow and promote the printed resolution of details and by default hold higher detail. You would have thought I was talking about killing fuzzy bunnies with a baseball bat daring to infringe on the cult of super high tension... :o

I can relate, i get the same thing any time i say that film doesn't need to have a density over 4.0 to be good. the next step is for some joke to post an image showing a broken mesh as proof the thinner mesh isn't any good.

Offline DouglasGrigar

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Re: Advantages of open area vs tight mesh and mesh thicknes
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2011, 11:16:27 AM »

I can relate, i get the same thing any time i say that film doesn't need to have a density over 4.0 to be good. the next step is for some joke to post an image showing a broken mesh as proof the thinner mesh isn't any good.

Both are worthy of overview in a rational way.

Both need to be subject to measurement and the pros and cons need to be reviewed.

I would invite you to the other thread to discuss the one further, as far as thin thread mesh, one of the “cons” or drawbacks is a more delicate nature there is no debate in that...

In the end the print  is king, but other considerations are also valid, what good is a super print if you have problems with the process needed to handle the mesh - possibly a mid thickness thread is a better choice - targeted to your needs in your shop.

Facts do not change - the appropriate nature of our application can.
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