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screen printing => Ink and Chemicals => Topic started by: JayzTeez on May 25, 2011, 09:11:46 PM
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This has probably been discussed before but i couldn't find it. i am currently using the Camie Flash Cure Spray Adhesive #375 , and Camie Screen Opener Spray # 480, as well as the C-60 when i happen to get ink where i don't want it. my question is what is out there that is as good or better than these but less toxic and hopefully as cheap or cheaper than these products. also i do notice i have been having trouble reclaiming certain screens is this due to cleaning them with paint thinner and the screen opener?
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Yea, I think you want to move away from the paint thinner.
For difficult images at reclaim time, I use a product named RENUIT by CCI from Graphic Solutions. Strong stuff, burns if you get it on you but works well. Only leave it on screen about 1-2 minutes before pressure wash out. Least it's not aerosol.
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Ditch the paint thinner.... rags with thinner are a fire hazard & there are health concerns.
Try a liquid pallet adhesive (I like Xenon Xentack) -or- use a pallet tape.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Xenon-Screen-Printing-Xentack-Pallet-Adhesive-/180275235998?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item29f93dcc9e (http://cgi.ebay.com/Xenon-Screen-Printing-Xentack-Pallet-Adhesive-/180275235998?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item29f93dcc9e)
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The Flash Cure Adhesive has been replaced in most shops by the brush on, card on.roll on, or even spray on water based adhesives that look like white glue. There are a whole slew of 'em out there. I use Tekbond TB-HV (http://tekmarltd.com/products/list/category/adhesive/) They actually get more aggressive with flashing, but are still not perfect for many on fleece.
And Wayne, The Liquid Renuit I use suggests 3-30 minutes dwell time. It might burn your skin, but it is no problem on the screen at those times. Nothing like the old base based paste haze removers like the Godzilla of haze removers, Autohaze . That stuff could eat a screen in ten minutes.
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I try to get if off within 2-3 mins, but let it on a bit longer one time and the screen ripped during pressure wash so figured it did have an 'eating' effect. I'm going to look into some kind of dip tank.
I had read the post thinking Camie Flash Cure Spray Adhesive #375 was for screen repair or something. I use TexTac for pallet adhesive now and love it.
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You've got to water down the Tex-Tac significantly if you want to get that shirt off the platen. I put it in an old squeeze mustard bottle and cut it almost 50%. Lasts seemingly forever.
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http://www.techsupportsps.com/store/supplies/aerosols-adhesives/tekmar/tekmar-tbhv-water-based-adhesive.html (http://www.techsupportsps.com/store/supplies/aerosols-adhesives/tekmar/tekmar-tbhv-water-based-adhesive.html)
Love it!
It gets to be STICKY at the start, but after 30-40 shirts is a BOMB :)
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This has probably been discussed before but i couldn't find it. i am currently using the Camie Flash Cure Spray Adhesive #375 , and Camie Screen Opener Spray # 480, as well as the C-60 when i happen to get ink where i don't want it. my question is what is out there that is as good or better than these but less toxic and hopefully as cheap or cheaper than these products. also i do notice i have been having trouble reclaiming certain screens is this due to cleaning them with paint thinner and the screen opener?
Xenon Xentack
Xenon Xenpac
Xenon Plastiwash
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I also use textac watered down a little...moving from aerosol adhesive was the best thing i ever did. My lungs, skin and all inanimate objects in the room, thank me. My first attempt at using it on our manual didn't go so well though--took the pallet rubber right off the presss LOL needless to say i put the bottle back on the shelf and used spray for another 2-3 years before giving it another shot...watering it down and thinly applying it is the key.
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you'll find that consensus is to ditch the spray adhesive and go with waterbased for the plattens. As with anything else, use manufacturer's recommendations and figure in a learning curve.
We use TexTac and used to water it down a lot, but are going away from that. Use a credit card or something similar and apply it very thin (as per manufacturer's instructions). Try one platten first. It helps if you put a scrap shirt on first to take away some stickiness. What ever they say bout the quantity to put on, stick with it. The glue will build up on itself as you spread it and if you put down to much it is almost like superglue (see Shelly's post).
We used to use Easyway 120 to do on press color changes until we talked to the manufacturer's rep and he said that 482 is a much better choice. Point here is, if you like a certain manufacturer, reach out and get the info from the horse's mouth rather than your sales rep.
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Double side tape sheets. Lasts for about 3k prints. Aerosol gets everywhere and makes the press look like it's covered in cobwebs.
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Thanks to Mooseman we have a video of how to clean lint from a pallet when Tackbond is used.
BTW, Mooseman, welcome to the board
DSCF7847 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1mMFmDvOPw#)
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Double side tape sheets. Lasts for about 3k prints. Aerosol gets everywhere and makes the press look like it's covered in cobwebs.
If you have to spray, make a mask out of cardboard. I have them in a few common sizes.
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That's a good idea. Great tip!
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I find a big difference between water based adhesives.
I've got some TexTac (cut 50/50 with water)... that I like for fleece. But man.... it's really hard to strip off the pallet when cleaning. Water won't touch it, I need a strong press wash like CCI RC-5 to get it off.
I prefer Xenon XenTack for tees..... it holds thin cotton well and clean up is much easier than the TexTac (IMHO).
Well done Mooseman.... gunna get me a big brush too ! AND, maybe some Mean Green.
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I find a big difference between water based adhesives.
I've got some TexTac (cut 50/50 with water)... that I like for fleece. But man.... it's really hard to strip off the pallet when cleaning. Water won't touch it, I need a strong press wash like CCI RC-5 to get it off.
Many use Palette tape (or Vinyl application tape ) to cover the boards, and just peel it off to clean. Stick on another, trim, put on your new adhesive.
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I find a big difference between water based adhesives.
I've got some TexTac (cut 50/50 with water)... that I like for fleece. But man.... it's really hard to strip off the pallet when cleaning. Water won't touch it, I need a strong press wash like CCI RC-5 to get it off.
I prefer Xenon XenTack for tees..... it holds thin cotton well and clean up is much easier than the TexTac (IMHO).
Well done Mooseman.... gunna get me a big brush too ! AND, maybe some Mean Green.
wait, are you using the platten tape? We just apply over and over and after a while peel the tape off and start from scratch.
I think my tape has been on for about 30K prints.
Or am I missing something? We clean about every 50 shirts or so just with water and a sponge. I think the brush method is worth a try though. Will do today!
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I find a big difference between water based adhesives.
I've got some TexTac (cut 50/50 with water)... that I like for fleece. But man.... it's really hard to strip off the pallet when cleaning. Water won't touch it, I need a strong press wash like CCI RC-5 to get it off.
Many use Palette tape (or Vinyl application tape ) to cover the boards, and just peel it off to clean. Stick on another, trim, put on your new adhesive.
Yup. My rubber tops are as white as they were when the press was new. Put down the platen tape, draw my center line, draw a neck line with a gallon emulsion pail bottom centered and 1-1/2" from the edge, and a centerline and baseline for pocket prints on the left side.
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Pierre et al.......You may want to try a few wet/dry wet applications and perhaps a bit weaker dillution......should get way more than 50 shirts. We used the d-sided tape at JSR but that stuff is expensive!
tp
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Pierre et al.......You may want to try a few wet/dry wet applications and perhaps a bit weaker dillution......should get way more than 50 shirts. We used the d-sided tape at JSR but that stuff is expensive!
tp
tony I am 50 shirts per platten between cleaning. That's 500 shirts printed before we wipe it down with a sponge. Are you saying we can get more by double applying the diluted adhesive?
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Its certainly possible.......something that needs to experimented with. Those broom handle brushes are the way to for cleaning rather than sponge IMO.
Interesting fact.......the Tekmar adhesive has been around for decades. We used it for belt printers. What sucked about ithen was you would need to remove and re-apply which was nasty business on an eight color belt. Thing is in all the shops I would work or visit you could never get it in their heads to drop and remove the cleaning system underneath while doing so. So all that gunked up tack would gum it up. Then you had to clean the cleaning system which could take an entire day. It was a sad fact that most belt printers were on their own with little or no training.
Point is don't try try to remove it chemically just change paper as necessary.
best tp
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Thanks alot for all the good advise as soon as the aerosol sprays are used up that i have i am replacing with the water based safer chemicals. i also use the pallet protek and love the product comes right off and the pallet is nice and clean. now i just have to figure out what to do with all my paint thinner.
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Thanks alot for all the good advise as soon as the aerosol sprays are used up that i have i am replacing with the water based safer chemicals. i also use the pallet protek and love the product comes right off and the pallet is nice and clean. now i just have to figure out what to do with all my paint thinner.
I would save some aerosol as there are cases when you will need it. We use it about once a year, but it would suck to have to go and buy a can!
As far as paint thinner, can't help you there.
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As far as paint thinner, can't help you there.
There is always thinning paint, and, used with reasonable caution, it does come in handy when cleaning old machinery, cars, bikes, etc.
For our purposes, it was always much more of an issue when it was 1/10 the cost of specialized cleaners. Now, I see it is more than half.
Much less temptation.
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Folks in the North Georgia Mountains tell me it's good for "Huffing"!
Sorry.........tp
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Folks in the North Georgia Mountains tell me it's good for "Huffing"!
Sorry.........tp
Unfortunately, huffers will inhale anything with a warning label.
(http://usera.imagecave.com/frogger/BoysHuffing.gif.jpg)
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Renuit is a great non hazardous dehazer. It will not harm the mesh in any way over a period of time, in fact it works quite well if you let dry in then re-energize again the next day thats the best method to get the most out of renuit. Anything that does not come out after that either needs a stronger caustic ghost remover or just toss in the trash.
If you are using thinner that is most likely why you are having a hard time reclaiming and probably have stained mesh as well. You can keep the screen opener for emergencies or do as I do and use a little renuit on a rag to open up a stubborn spot.
Definitely water down the water baesd glue either by mixing it with water in a container or simply by adding a dot of glue on the palette then a drop of water as well and spread across the palette. If you don't water it down a bit your first shirts will be a bear to remove and possibly have some glue left over on the shirt.
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Well you know me I'm always different.
If your shop has air...if you use one of these, it is all you ever will again.
I cut the WB glue 1/4 water and 3/4 glue. If the gun is clean it will work on 30 or so psi...dirty about 50.
It is a touch-up paint gun so very little over spray.
Light mist for paper goods. medium for tees and a little more and a little more often for fleece.
On clean boards I can spray one time for about every 100 shirts. I do like the food coloring idea.
Does it not come off on white shirts? I can always find a way to mess something up. :P
Hang it from a bungee and go.
I paid $8 for two of them off ebay, but walley world or auto parts stores have them.
Big auto shops use one almost the same that cost $600
(http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i157/killergraphx/spray-gun.jpg)
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I like to ride along with the popular vote so to elaborate on my earlier TexTac post -
I use a mustard bottle (someone else said that) and put down about a silver dollar size dollop. Then using a wet paper towel spread the adhesive around then hit it under the flash. The wet paper towel does the dilution for me. Saves on the credit card for me.
I use pallet tape too so I don't ever worry about cleaning the TexTac off the pallets.
I find that just a wet paper towel does a nice, quick, job removing the lint and has little effect on the adhesive so can be done quite a few times before having to touch up the adhesive.
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Water base glue is the best. My press looks brand new after I blow it off with the air nozzle.
I use CCI Top Bond. I mix it in a Rubbermaid disposable tuberware dish. I mix up about a half inch of it (40/60 or more will last me 250 – 500 shirts) Then brush it on with a foam brush. (good control) When I am done I put the brush in the container with the remaining glue, put the cover on and it’s good to use the next time. I have diluted this stuff so much you can almost see through it and it still works. I really don't think the amount of glue you put down matters. The glue is not coming off. The lint is covering the glue making it less sticky. That’s why you can wipe off the lint and your good to go again. (on my manual I stopped cleaning the boards and I just apply another layer of glue when needed. I went 5 months once and had a 2/16ths thickness of lint)
Suppliers must hate this stuff. A $16 quart will last me 6 months. A $5 can of the old stuff would last me a few days.
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I used a credit card, but it was too much of a hassle. Try a mini foam roller from home depot or lowes or wherever. They work great and you can continue to use them for a long time.
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Hey Guy's,
Any kind of pallet tape preferred?
Conform Type
Medium Tack
High Tack
Removing tips?
Thanks!
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I just use a medium tack application type tape. It usually removes fine, sometimes tears and splits a bit, but never so much as to really become an issue.
Some of the guys stack 'em, four or five levels, to make the peeling of the top one faster and easier.
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Thanks Mr. Frog!
Enjoy your posts frequently!
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R Tape is the one I use. No issues when removing (might be because I have newer pallets)
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Glad to see you post finally Gary!
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Yeah, kind of quiet over here.
Going all day long...