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screen printing => General Screen Printing => Topic started by: jsheridan on June 27, 2011, 11:43:37 AM
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If you had to start over from the ground up what would you do or not do differently..
I ask as I just secured some capital and it's time to start buying equipment and supplies for my garage based startup.
I have a line on the big 4 pieces (press, dryer, flash and expose) for around 6k. I've had some rollers for years and a friendly supplier is giving me a hookup on supplies. I'll be building a washout and any racks and assorted stuff.
discuss..
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Boy, where to start.
Since I bought the business as is, I am lucky. I would do it this way again, but while I was working here before I owned it, I would have straightened more of the bugs out and invested a little more in testing equipment. I would have also had the shop in perfectly clean working order. I am finding that I am spending too much time organizing and reworking the shop. Who knows if that will ever end.
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Off the top of my head, for equip my top two are probably:
Bigger dryer from the get-go.
Backlit washout booth.
If I was in yer shoes and had the trade skills already I would heavily consider going big up front though. The way I built up our shop, piece by piece, just scrapping along was cool and suited me well for those years (I always said "hey, I'm in this for less than most people drop on a used car and used cars don't make money for you") but there was a point where I should've flipped the switch on a lot of gear all at once along with enough working capital to fund the co. through the growing pains and just rolled out with it. It's riskier to do this and I was Mr. Bootstrap for a long, long time but, if you know the work is there, you just wind up saving a lot of $ and hassle in the long run by getting most everything you need now.
Once I bit my lip and signed off on the loan finally I realized the synergy that happens with everything. You put all that risky money out there but, if you do it right, it just brings solid, dependable revenue back around in quick time. The key is to make sure you have the production tools to keep up when this happens. I'm feeling that mistake right now. :o
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wish we had a management program from day 1. Before any equipment. . .most important tool that gets overlooked in my opinion. how else do you know what to charge?. . .exactly. . .
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I would agree with Zoo about bigger dryer. I have Atlas 824 (8', with 24" belt) which suites my basement set-up and I would not have room for anything bigger. But now I wish that I have something more than a 4' heat chamber.
Also, do not cheap out in inks and supplies. Get the good and proven stuff.
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that is a good one homer, they didn't exist when we started.
I agree with ZOO about the dryer. I will be adding 4' of heat in the next year or so. That is what's nice about modular stuff, add on or subtract as you need it.
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my story is a little different, it was a business decision from day one. Can't think of anything I would do different off the top of my head other than have a better communications with my partner.
You know all the equipment and the processes better then most. So the printing part will be easy. Make sure you have good planning and have marketing money. Those two will make you or break you.
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If I could go back, I probably would of waited until I was a little older. I leased my equipment when I was 19, for my basement setup. I figured since I was a decent enough printer, I could make it work... not realizing that I don't know anything about getting clients, running a business, and knowing what to charge. So that is what I get for being an impulsive teenager. I had a consistent pay check at my other printing job, so it's not like I sunk all my money into the equipment, but it was definitely a learning experience. In the last 6 months or so I've really been reading up on business, marketing, etc and after I change the name of my business I'm going to come up with a monthly budget for some consistent advertising online. Dealing with people has seem to become less of a fear as I get older. And I'm finding that people are starting to take me a little more seriously, so that helps also.
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Thanks guys.
I'm looking at a used Lawson kit that comes with the 3610 dryer (36" belt 6' heat) that is more than enough for the garage. I have to disconnect a panel or upgrade wiring to handle it's 58 amp draw.
As soon as I can afford it, shopworx will be used, till then it's quickbooks with it's printing add-on module.
I'll be using roller frames, panels, top grade inks and chemicals and even getting a 4880 printer.
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Thanks guys.
I'm looking at a used Lawson kit that comes with the 3610 dryer (36" belt 8' heat) that is more than enough for the garage. I have to disconnect a panel or upgrade wiring to handle it's 58 amp draw.
As soon as I can afford it, shopworx will be used, till then it's quickbooks with it's printing add-on module.
I'll be using roller frames, panels, top grade inks and chemicals and even getting a 4880 printer.
You want our 4800? Got to get a wider one sometime in the next 3 months or sooner. I'll cut you a deal mang.
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You want our 4800? Got to get a wider one sometime in the next 3 months or sooner. I'll cut you a deal mang.
Come with RIP? I'll take dibs on it if my 4880 deal doesn't work out.
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wish we had a management program from day 1. Before any equipment. . .most important tool that gets overlooked in my opinion. how else do you know what to charge?. . .exactly. . .
So what are you using for management?
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T-Quoter for shirts and a similar program just for signage. Works the best for us.
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You want our 4800? Got to get a wider one sometime in the next 3 months or sooner. I'll cut you a deal mang.
Come with RIP? I'll take dibs on it if my 4880 deal doesn't work out.
Sure I'll throw the accurip in and it's loaded with the filmdirect system. New head installed early this year to boot!
Got a line on a 44" wide epson?
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Hey Zoo -I have a hookup on a 60" HP -1k if you want it. . .I was thinking about it, but we have too many printers as it is. I want a 24"
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NONE
I would sub it all out...the money is in the selling not the doing!!!
Sam
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I agree with Sam!
But,
We recently went through the whole "starting over" here, after we lost everything in an arson fire in Dec. of '08.
Ya, we had insurance and all that but that's a whole different headache all by itself.
The owners had been doing this since 1981, so there was the question if we were even going to rebuild at all, or just take whatever settlement and call it quits.
The hardest part was having the patience to actually THINK through whatever popped up, and not just make snap decisions to get something done to move on to the next "crisis."
We were/are fortunate that we have a very supportive community and great working relationships with the other shops around us.
So...some things we did:
Start with the end in mind. (This is far harder than it sounds for some people) We sat down as a company to lay out our "DREAM SHOP". Nothing was off limits, equipment, layout, building, personnel, etc. Once we had it, then we let "Reality" in the door to cut it down from there.
Once that was kind of done, a new "mission statement" if you will, was loosely created and a road map to get there was laid out. Not so much a business plan, it is more of a map.
Right or wrong, good or bad, we are going to follow it.
Since that time, we've had 2 employees leave, a part timer and a full timer that had been here 11 years, and a part timer step up to full time. We're now at 2 owners (husband/wife) and two full time employees(myself being one of them). Some people handle change well, some don't even when they agree to the changes initially.
Equipment:
Even though some of our equipment was salvageable from the fire, the insurance co. kind of locked it up for as long as the claim remained open. Ex. We had/have a Workhorse Mach VIII press. It didn't really take much damage, but if we decided to clean it up right away and try to see if we could get back to work with it, the ins. co. wouldn't pay out on it for a replacement press. So it got put in storage with a bunch of other questionable stuff that became the property of the insurance co. for 2 years. It was finally written off as scrap and now it's all ours again. (I really hate ins. companies!)
We knew we wanted equip. that was completely interchangeable from start to finish, manual or auto.
At the time M&R and Anatol were the only 2 that fit the bill. Anatol didn't have anybody in the NW (at the time) which was extremely important to the boss, so that left M&R. Then it was just which dist. do we get it from. Midwest or Ryonet were our top 2 choices. Our rep from Midwest (Jeff Macy) came over the week after the fire to sincerely help us with anything he could. Not just jump on a sales opportunity. That was all it took. Actual face time goes a looooong way with the boss. Even if it costs a little more. Plus, he'd been dealing with Midwest since before they were called Midwest.
With the help of an architect friend, I became an overnight Google SketchUp whiz (OK, I suck at it, she did most of it). We laid out at least 10 different floorplans for the shop. Trying to maximize workflow, efficiency, showroom space, etc. And the 3D walkthrough made it easy for everybody to see what would work & what just didn't look/feel right.
Oh, crap, I better go to work....
To summarize.....Start with the end (your dream shop) in mind. Then work backwards. Don't get caught up in " I'll get this now, then change to this later" because later will end up being a LONG time.
Don't settle for something less than you want until your positive you've explored ALL options. And then, read Sam's post.
Map out your path, then stick to it. Getting sidetracked can be a killer.
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If I had to do it all over again tomorrow. I would skipped manual printing period. Sorry but after going auto, I see how much time I wasted.
I would probably not do a lot of other things too much differently. Pretty happy with where we are for a 2 person shop.
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I would sub it all out...the money is in the selling not the doing!!!
So true and so very lame. I try to keep myself and this company out of that game as much as possible. If I'm going to participate in this hoax we loosely refer to as American capitalism I'm going to at least hone a trade, a craft, a skill...actually do something for my pay.
Not that folks who resell items are doing nothing, they're valuable and play a role, it's just not the role I'm into and neither are a lot of printers. If you're printing, you have to have some love for the process because we ain't exactly getting rich doing this work. I'd make more $ working an hourly job just about anywhere else, probably even arby's or something than I do owning and operating this company.
But Sam's right, that's where the money is. Do some small service that connects people to the other people who have what they want. There's a guy in town here who's a millionaire just from providing transfer services for freight shipments, simple as that, him and I think one other employee do it all from a couple of computers a few days a week.
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ha, capitalism isn't a hoax, well it wouldn't be if the government wasn't picking winners and losers.
I think subbing it out would cause me too much stress. I had 2 ASI orders go bad just this week due to dumbass vendors not being able to read or download art.
At least with what I do I can control workflow.
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ha, capitalism isn't a hoax, well it wouldn't be if the government wasn't picking winners and losers.
Yeah, pretty much. Didn't mean to stir up a long-winded thread of political ranting or anything by saying that but it seemed relevant. The fact that those who make the most money don't actually produce anything is telling. I want no part of that.
Now back to startup advice for John....let's start a new thread if we want to debate subbing out v. in-house. There's lots to be said about it on a lot of different levels I think.
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I agree, there are pluses and minuses to both ways of doing it. But I do agree that I would rather learn a skill or craft in the process. I like looking over a pile of completed work, rather than a pile of money...umm, scratch that, can I have both?
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...umm, scratch that, can I have both?
Hahaha! I was thinking that same thing as I was typing. I'm Mr. Proud Laborer ranting on about having a skill but lord knows that pile 'o cash wouldn't hurt either.
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Hey John,
Great to see you on here. Brandon from the M&R forums. Just got on the other day. So just realize the first two years or so you will have to give up most of your life. Pays to be single during that time. But to do it over again I would have just went straight to a DiamondBack or something similar by Anatol. You are already a great printer and have all of those issues down. Why spend time with a manual when that auto can free up your time to get more orders. So I would just go bigger from the start. You know how to print so focus on the business. And keep everything clean and organized from day one. Now having several employees I constantly feel like I am picking up after kids. Clean as you go is my motto. Hopefully I'm making sense. Its getting late and I'm beat!
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It's adult daycare. ;D
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i would have got a small auto to start.
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NONE
I would sub it all out...the money is in the selling not the doing!!!
Sam
Love ya Sam!! ;D
I was doing this for the last 6 months but either the printer sucked or we couldn't agree on pricing. It was a headache and maybe it's just me but damn.. people don't know how to print around here.. jeesh! It's white ink ppl... not pudding.
I'd rather make the shirts and have a shop to print that guys stuff.. you can always sub all your stuff to me, help me get my auto quicker 8)
i would have got a small auto to start.
I'm waiting for an older gauntlet to hit my area that is priced right. Looked at one a few weeks ago and it was beyond it's last leg.. sad as had they just greased it even once a month, it would have been cherry.
I really wanted to start with an auto but funding and customer base is keeping me with a manual setup. 5 years ago when I tried to start this I had 2 solid customers and some really good contract work lined up but not enough money to secure the deal. Now I'm starting smaller, like the dream shop idea slimmed back to fit my needs right now.
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I would have tried to buy my auto sooner......................but I did not have the room like I do know.
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I would have went auto first as well. With all the money I have invested in equipment I could have almost bought what I am looking at in cash.
Hey Zoo have you sold that Epson printer?
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If I had to do it all over again I would have found more info on this type of fourm before buying a hobby press. I did learn from my mistake
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I would buy very very good Business Management Software on day one, even if I had to take a loan for it.
And stick hardly to use every possible feature on consistent day to day base..
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i would hire a full time printer as soon as i could afford one and focus on sales. i would not try to do it all thinking im saving money while actually losing more in lost sales.also as this time i would impliment business software early on as already mentioned
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1. scoped out a better city to start my business that's not so over saturated with print shops
2. started out with RJennings equipment instead of junk
3. gallon mixing system
4. business classes
I sort of landed face first into this business by accident , printing for my band and then other bands and so forth. Started the business on 100 bucks and printing 1 color prints with no press and a heat gun for curing and then later a home built 1 color press, then a POS ebay press and a flash dryer for curing, to what I have now a full shop. Looking back starting out with the basic of the basics I have learned more and appreciate and respect what I have now in the shop. Next move... bigger shop,auto, and a few employees.
I like the idea of hiring help and focusing more on the business end of the business. Sometimes I get too wrapped up in doing the manual work my sales start to slip from not being able to keep up with emails and phone calls not to mention sales promotions. Gets to be a bit hetic for a 1 man shop.