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screen printing => General Screen Printing => Topic started by: inkbrigade on August 30, 2011, 06:58:51 AM
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I'd like to hear comments from the people here but also from ink companies as well.
I'm wondering what kind of bulb would be the smartest to have around the shop for looking at ink colors? From time to time I hear i should have daylight bulbs. I head incandescent, i hear i should build a light box, etc etc.
I'd just like to know what kind of light would be the best to represent how the ink colors will look. Sorry if this doesn't make sense. It's super late.
Jamie
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That's long been an issue here. We know the inks look different under different lights. We decided since most of our stuff is for retail, souvenir type stores we'd use the lighting most likely to be seen there. Lots of spot light, incandescent bulbs. So we won't be critical looking at the prints under a cool white bulb as much as we are under a bright incandescent. It's been EXTREMELY rare to have someone not happy with their ink color. We know we can't be everything to everyone, so we do what we think is best for most customers.
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At Starter we had a neutral Grey Box with 3 different light sources. Daylight Fluorescent and 1 other that slips my mind. The critical component of our system was the Neutral Grey box. I want to say that the box was about the same color as Russell Grey or Pantone 422. Check out Lowes or some paint store and see what they have.
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I know they have lights that have certain specs (I forget what the technical terms are), that are supposed to give true colors. When I have a customer that seems to be really be looking over the colors, we step outside.
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In the past, when cross checking dye lots, I have built viewing boxes painted neutral gray and includind up to three light sources....daylight, incandescent, store lighting etc. I wired that we could view colors under any possible combination.
Certain colors particularly pinks and purples are metameric, meaning they will shift depending the light source the substrate is viewed under. For a quick overview of lighting sources, measurement, and color accuracy you can check Pantones website or believe it or not, your Grainger catalog has information on all this. Pantone also sells viewing boxes for a ridiculous amount of money for us tee shirt guys.
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Beats me, but I split my bulbs between soft white and daylight bulbs in the warehouse. It gives it a nice mix.
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In the past, when cross checking dye lots, I have built viewing boxes painted neutral gray and includind up to three light sources....daylight, incandescent, store lighting etc. I wired that we could view colors under any possible combination.
Certain colors particularly pinks and purples are metameric, meaning they will shift depending the light source the substrate is viewed under. For a quick overview of lighting sources, measurement, and color accuracy you can check Pantones website or believe it or not, your Grainger catalog has information on all this. Pantone also sells viewing boxes for a ridiculous amount of money for us tee shirt guys.
So Pantone charges an arm and a leg for these. . . What's a cheap AND easy solution?
pierre
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5000k
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In the past, when cross checking dye lots, I have built viewing boxes painted neutral gray and includind up to three light sources....daylight, incandescent, store lighting etc. I wired that we could view colors under any possible combination.
Certain colors particularly pinks and purples are metameric, meaning they will shift depending the light source the substrate is viewed under. For a quick overview of lighting sources, measurement, and color accuracy you can check Pantones website or believe it or not, your Grainger catalog has information on all this. Pantone also sells viewing boxes for a ridiculous amount of money for us tee shirt guys.
So Pantone charges an arm and a leg for these. . . What's a cheap AND easy solution?
Good Morning Pierre.......Grainger and a Saturday with some power tools, a friend or two, and a pizza!
pierre
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I just remembered I wrote an article on this about eight ys ago maybe in printwear if anyone wants to Google search it. No plans but some photos of finished booth.
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I came from offset printing (design side). I never really understand the light box for viewing colors. So you make this box so that the colors are 100% true in the box. The press guy takes a printed sample under the light box to compare the print to the pantone colors. I don't see the reason to have a true color box for comparing colors. The light your under will affect both colors the same. You just have to adjust the colors to make them look the same. No reason to have a true color light box. I understand it may be easier to adjust colors but not needed.
I was once told to use full spectrum lighting. They are the Daylight bulbs you can find everywhere now.
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Hello Everyone!
Wilflex color matches using Cool White Fluorescent with the colors printed through a 156 mesh onto a white cotton swatch or garment.
However, many other companies match to different requirements. For example Nike and Adidas require that their colors be matched under Daylight 65.
I have seen many printers develop their own color charts which is actual ink cured on a garment to show what a color will actually look like to a customer. It will show what the color looks like in their shop, outside or in the bathroom with flourescent lighting.
Erin
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Thats right Erin........for Nike each season we would get a "kit" with printed samples, films. BOMs, and color chips to match. Often these would be pieces of sneaker , shoelace, or other material. Part of the approval process is to match these colors on two inch circles under those lighting conditions. There were always two formulas......one for a white shirt one for a white underbase.
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Thats right Erin........for Nike each season we would get a "kit" with printed samples, films. BOMs, and color chips to match. Often these would be pieces of sneaker , shoelace, or other material. Part of the approval process is to match these colors on two inch circles under those lighting conditions. There were always two formulas......one for a white shirt one for a white underbase.
funny you mention that. I thought I was crazy for having two different Pantone 123C's for my super picky customer. One is for the white shirts and the other goes on the underbase. Printing on white makes the ink turn darker and printing on an underbase usually lightens it up (at least through the 305's we use for top colors). So to make them look the same I mixed two different inks!
pierre
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I came from offset printing (design side). I never really understand the light box for viewing colors. So you make this box so that the colors are 100% true in the box. The press guy takes a printed sample under the light box to compare the print to the pantone colors. I don't see the reason to have a true color box for comparing colors. The light your under will affect both colors the same. You just have to adjust the colors to make them look the same. No reason to have a true color light box. I understand it may be easier to adjust colors but not needed.
I was once told to use full spectrum lighting. They are the Daylight bulbs you can find everywhere now.
Yea, thats what I said, color temp 5000K.
We use it almost everwhere.
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We can talk all day about different bulb types, etc. but as previously mentioned it comes down to the color temp anyway. It also comes down the CRI value at that color temp.
I think, if it all possible or within budget, you should have decent lighting in your shop. 5500-6500 k is ideal they say, as it's closest to natural sunlight. You start with matching the temp to daylight then you try to get a high CRI. I read somewhere that-
"An ideal light source for color rendering will have both a color temperature similar to daylight and a high CRI value."
We have Triten 50 "full spectrum" bulbs @ 5000k, 85cri and boy howdy are they the nicest fluorsecents I've ever worked under. Quiet, instant-on, very "neutral" feeling in color yet very bright and no noticeable flicker- you can work under them for hours on end. The 96" bulbs cost around $13/pc. The electronic ballasts that fire the T8 buls are the most expensive part but they keep the flicker and hum to a minimum as a bonus. I like these things so much I might pull the ballasts out and re-install them in my new shop.
So, I use our shop lights for swatch checks since it's consistent and the color seems quite "accurate" compared to daily life conditions to me. You also get about the same lighting from one end to the other. So if I mix at one end we're not a world apart when someone checks it at the back of the dryer.
Cool White Erin? Really?! Those bulbs are the worst to me, they seem to throw color so far off. But, I'll bet that's the most common bulb in print shops.
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I never really understand the light box for viewing colors.
You're reducing the number of variables for viewing. Yes, you could always view in the same spot in the shop or in an office, but there is always the possibility of other variables when doing this. (different levels of ambient light throughout the day, etc.)
The human brain is really, really good at "flattening" all the variables in our perception as conditions change, so viewing in an open environment can produce different results from day to day, even minute to minute. Hence, light box.
BTW - you can use a small, windowless room painted in a neutral grey for fairly reliable viewing as long as the lighting is not too warm or cool.
It's also good to have one or more "double check" areas to view color, like a skylight at a certain time of the day, a bathroom, etc.
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I had a sales call from a lighting vendor today (at my real job). He brought in an LED lay-in light fixture with some impressive spec's.
It was a 4000K with a CRI of 93. So, that's a good cross between daylight and storelight. The price is right ($200/ea).
I'm interested in them for energy reasons... these are 44 watts and replace a 3 lamp fluorescent (about 85 watts). They provide 80% light level for about 75,000 hours (compared to 25,000 for a standard fluorescent). So they are pretty much maintenance free for the life of the product (if you burn them 12 hours a day).
Plus... these are 100% American made with 100% American components (CREE brand made in N. Carolina)
LED technology has some pitfalls.... these have made the leap to viability by using a novel heatsink to get full LED life.
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LED is interesting for sure. I've never seen a good one in person though. I just wonder how it "feels"?