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screen printing => Waterbase and Discharge => Topic started by: ericheartsu on May 21, 2015, 04:14:20 PM

Title: pigment streaks
Post by: ericheartsu on May 21, 2015, 04:14:20 PM
We are in the middle of a large run of Waterbased prints, and we keep having to stop like every 10 prints to clean stupid pigment streaks in the ink.

What can we do to avoid this? We already mixed it, strained it, and mixed it some more.

We are using the Matsui pigments in Green Galaxy Opaque base, through 200s and 225s screens
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: Admiral on May 21, 2015, 04:20:31 PM
Make sure the squeegee isn't the culprit to putting in a line of a different color into the screen.  Not sure what else it could be.  Emulsion is holding up fine right?
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: ebscreen on May 21, 2015, 04:37:47 PM
What are you straining through?

Single or double stroke?
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: ericheartsu on May 21, 2015, 04:50:57 PM
It's def. the pigments used to make the ink. Emulsion is fine.

It's being strained through a mesh strainer, and being mixed by hand and with a power drill mixer
Double stroke on everything.
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: mimosatexas on May 21, 2015, 04:59:40 PM
i've had this issue with the matsui pigments as well.  No quick fix for you unfortunately...
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: ebscreen on May 21, 2015, 05:01:54 PM
I suppose I meant what mesh, we've never had anything get past a 110, but you never know.
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: ericheartsu on May 21, 2015, 05:14:03 PM
I suppose I meant what mesh, we've never had anything get past a 110, but you never know.

it's a 3 color job. the black is fine, that's on a 225. Then there is a coral and a green, those are both on 200s
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: ericheartsu on May 21, 2015, 05:14:25 PM
i've had this issue with the matsui pigments as well.  No quick fix for you unfortunately...

I wonder if Rutland pigments have this issue?
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: ebscreen on May 21, 2015, 05:17:54 PM
And I suppose I meant what mesh you were filtering through. I'll get it straight one of these posts...


Rutland pigs do have this problem. Any concentrated pigment will.
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: ericheartsu on May 21, 2015, 05:42:26 PM
And I suppose I meant what mesh you were filtering through. I'll get it straight one of these posts...


Rutland pigs do have this problem. Any concentrated pigment will.

oh sorry, we aren't using any mesh, just though the strainer it self
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: ebscreen on May 21, 2015, 05:53:38 PM
Give a scrap piece of 110 or so a try.

Also look and see if the ink is climbing up the squeegee a bit and drying out. We've had that
happen with a ton of ink in the screen. Obnoxious.
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: ericheartsu on May 21, 2015, 06:08:03 PM
no climbing, but i'm gonna try that mesh in the strainer!

thanks!!
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: ZooCity on May 21, 2015, 06:56:11 PM
Yep, strain it.  You need the right micron opening of the mesh to catch the chunks without inhibiting the flow too much.  We put a piece of mesh between the cap and the bottle/spout of the pig containers.  In rare cases we still have to pull an ink and strain it again.  Experimenting now with ss mesh discs from MMC, I just matched the micron opening to one of our mesh counts to determine which tpi to get.  Seems to be going well so far. 
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: ol man on May 21, 2015, 09:43:44 PM
ZooCity - great idea
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: tonypep on May 22, 2015, 07:55:07 AM
We never strain. Its all in how to contain and dispense the PCs. Hint: Its not in the manufacturers containers
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: sqslabs on May 22, 2015, 08:44:15 AM
We used to have a lot of issues with this and realized that it was usually due to dried pigment around the inside edges of the container.  We now wash the tips before each use and it has helped immensely.  Using a drill press for mixing should help a bit as well if you aren't already.

White and black pigments have always been the most troublesome in my experience, and I stay away from white pigs altogether these days.  Matsui's 301M is a much better solution for standard WB inks and we use white discharge ink in place of white pigs for discharge mixes.  As for black, we'll go as far as to transfer pigment containers before mixing to ensure none of the dried pigment gets into the ink.
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: ZooCity on May 22, 2015, 04:33:23 PM
We never strain. Its all in how to contain and dispense the PCs. Hint: Its not in the manufacturers containers

Oh another riddle!  What kind of container prevents concentrated wb ink drying on the sidewalls or in the dispensing caps......
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: sqslabs on May 22, 2015, 05:12:05 PM
Oh another riddle!  What kind of container prevents concentrated wb ink drying on the sidewalls or in the dispensing caps......

I'll take a shot... an upside down one?
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: Itsa Little CrOoked on May 22, 2015, 05:21:26 PM
Or, it could be manufactured in a secret underground bunker made from 100% pure Unobtainium.
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: Colin on May 22, 2015, 06:24:36 PM
But it's unobtainable!

Condiment bottles are great for pigment dispensers.  Also if you can store a bottle up side down, even better.

Or.... do the parents here remember the baby formula bottles of old that used the plastic bag inserts?  It kept the babies from gulping down air.....
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: tonypep on May 23, 2015, 07:41:45 AM
Sorry if I am cagey however most know I am restricted here. Also know I encourage you all to free think. Storing/dispensing upside down is a perfect example of solving one problem that may result in causing others.
Pre-treatment is a term applied most often applied to many industrial applications. It certainly applies here.
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: acescreen on May 24, 2015, 12:30:08 AM
Once again great info from a great group of guys here in this forum!!! We use the CCI mixing pigments and have enjoyed it so far but the last few runs we've had this issue as well. I will definitely try straining and look for a better way to mix. 

Thanks for the sharing info guys!

Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: JBLUE on May 25, 2015, 12:53:41 PM
Change out your pigments into bottles that do not build up dried pigment around the openings. Hard to do but it will stop the issue.
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: mimosatexas on May 25, 2015, 01:00:15 PM
Have a link?  I tried at least 5 different dropper style bottles and they all had issues with pigments drying and gunking up over time.
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: JBLUE on May 25, 2015, 09:07:08 PM
Have a link?  I tried at least 5 different dropper style bottles and they all had issues with pigments drying and gunking up over time.


We just wipe ours down before putting the cap on. We keep them very clean. The only time we run in to this is when the build up is not kept clean and some falls in during mixing. Just like anything else in the shop if its not kept clean it will cause issues at some point. We swap out the tops of the Rutand pigments righ away. The Magna pigment containers are just as bad. The tips we use are the same tips that are on the bottles on this link. We got them from a local vendor.  http://www.amazon.com/Fine-Tip-Squeeze-Bottle-Cap-Pack/dp/B001HKV682/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&qid=1432601794&sr=8-10&keywords=fine+tip+squeeze+bottle (http://www.amazon.com/Fine-Tip-Squeeze-Bottle-Cap-Pack/dp/B001HKV682/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&qid=1432601794&sr=8-10&keywords=fine+tip+squeeze+bottle)
Title: Re: pigment streaks
Post by: T Shirt Farmer on May 26, 2015, 09:53:09 AM
pigments in ketchup bottle - fish tank or water tight container -  fit a  rectangle of  plastic coated wire 1/2" opening resting 2" off bottom of tank - fill with 4"water -place ketchup bottle tip down into water so the tip is in one of the holes in wire and will stand straight  up - half cap of Clorox in water every 2 weeks so it does not scum - I can almost guarantee you will not have dried chunks if the tip lives under water when not in use. I imagine if you are a high volume user like tony this may not be an issue but for the occasional WB user I think this pigment storage is the bomb. Part of Monday morning opening the shop is shaking ALL pigment containers as some colors may not be used for weeks at a time.