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screen printing => General Screen Printing => Topic started by: ericheartsu on February 03, 2016, 06:26:12 PM
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We just had a client order 400pcs of a 6 color discharge print, where the print goes off the edge of the tee. This is for a well known artist in Houston and internationally that we've worked with in the past, and is always finding something wrong.
Prints came out perfectly, and we were so stoked on them. We matched all pantones perfectly, placement on all tees was awesome, and the discharge prints made the tees soft. softer than he was expecting. While inspecting them at the shop, he was so blown away.
4 days later he writes complaining that the pressure marks on the garment are causing him to lose sales. He is selling his shirts in galleries, and they cannot have this issue, so on and so forth.
This will be our last job with this artist, as these shirts came out amazing. We were so proud of them, and for this to be a knit picky issue drives me crazy.
BUT! i'm wondering what we could have done to avoid this. Before, during, and after the print.
any ideas?
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You can work those out with those handheld steamers if it is just the edge mark from the platen. Could sand the edge of your platens (assuming they are rubber) as well. I've never had someone complain about them, but it does happen and sometimes on the more glaring ones I will "fix" them before giving to the client.
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Isn't this the same guy that blamed you before for a lack of sales?
Joke man... joke.
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Isn't this the same guy that blamed you before for a lack of sales?
Joke man... joke.
haha someone else posted that. Last time we printed for this guy, he asked us to recommend a shirt, which we did, then he said they were to big and made us reprint them. This order he went with the same shirt we recommended last time.
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Time to move on... let him become someone else's problem.
Got any competitors that you don't like? ;)
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this is the print in question.
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Nice print. I don't see the sides where the marks would be.
"We can steam them out at $0.50 a piece or you can wait a week/first wash and fuggedaboutit"
I'm guessing his real issue is the timeliness of the subject and resulting sales. New week, new dead celebrity.
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he has actually made this art for several years, alot of it was actually for david bowie's camp.
timeline isn't an issue, but i just don't think there is anything that can be done.
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what marks? I don't see anything...
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this is a production sample that we kept for future ink matching purposes, and there aren't any on here. i don't know what he is seeing on his side though.
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BUT! i'm wondering what we could have done to avoid this. Before, during, and after the print.
any ideas?
I'm sure you know this but I'll throw it out anyway.
Make sure squeegee edges are rounded
Make sure squeegee is not hanging over the edge of the pallet
If squeegee pressure is excessive on press most likely the mesh is not open enough - try a more open mesh
If you do get the marks in the shirt on a waterbase job due to trying to saturate the fibers, have a spray bottle with water that you can mist over the pallet marks prior to going through the dryer(make certain your fully curing your ink as if you spray water over the printed image area you can run into issues). But for us here pallet marks are big no, if we run into a job that has them we will spray the marks with water, use a felt brush to relocate the fibers(sometimes not needed), then run back through the dryer. We try to setup the job to avoid any pallet marks but there's certain jobs that I have found which its the nature of the beast so we will use the above method which works for us.
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BUT! i'm wondering what we could have done to avoid this. Before, during, and after the print.
any ideas?
I'm sure you know this but I'll throw it out anyway.
Make sure squeegee edges are rounded
Make sure squeegee is not hanging over the edge of the pallet
If squeegee pressure is excessive on press most likely the mesh is not open enough - try a more open mesh
If you do get the marks in the shirt on a waterbase job due to trying to saturate the fibers, have a spray bottle with water that you can mist over the pallet marks prior to going through the dryer(make certain your fully curing your ink as if you spray water over the printed image area you can run into issues). But for us here pallet marks are big no, if we run into a job that has them we will spray the marks with water, use a felt brush to relocate the fibers(sometimes not needed), then run back through the dryer. We try to setup the job to avoid any pallet marks but there's certain jobs that I have found which its the nature of the beast so we will use the above method which works for us.
Thanks Danny! We used smiling jacks for this job, so all the corners were rounded, but i'll double check.
is the spray water bottle method something that you all do after they are cured?
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I know that guy. Got a few of his prints..... Print looks great. If you wash the shirts the marks should disappear.... We have some clients that pay the extra fees to get the shirts washed so the discharge feels super soft and no pressure marks. One has to understand that a t-shirt is not like paper.... I also think print is awesome for this job. I think you have it right to pass on clients like this....
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We retired two direct to the artist relationships.
Still have several. Some need to be retired and don't worry about it. It all depends on how
You retire them
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I am also very impressed on the thread redye switch on the over print black layer? And I right? Did yall add that in the art or is does that thread not discharge.
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For us when it happens(I would love to talk to an auto shop that doesn't experience occasional pallet/pressure marks and learn how they do it) it's usually on a youth garment or sleeve print where someone in my shop was just not thinking/caring or whatever and put on a squeegee that was wider then the pallet on the press. I've also had this happen on some garments due to the dye or type of material. So for us it can depend if we are getting rid of pallet marks before the dryer or after. If we are printing a garment/location of print that we cannot avoid the marks and know this after some test prints, I cut a sheet of cardboard a little bigger then the printed design and have the unloader cover the design with it then spray some water on the marks, pull and into the dryer. Lower the dryer temp and belt speed(test and wash test though). If someone in my shop prints a job that has pallet marks the people I have working in shipping are trained to catch this when boxing. Shirts come off dryer, get folded then put in bins, then sent back to another dept/set of eyes so sometimes shipping will see some pallet marks and have to fix after production. At that point they either steam them out or if a dryer is open take them and run them through with misted water. I'd love to hear from some vets or shops that have been able to avoid this as we had it come up with some clients several years ago and now try to avoid it like the plaque.
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That sucks, sometimes it seems its just unavoidable.
Very nice looking print.
Murphy
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magic sizing should do it. spray it and let it dry. no need to tunnel dry them. It's an old embroidery trick for removing hoop burn.
The stuff is cheap too, $1 a can(roughly) at Wal-Mart or grocery stores, look for it by the ironing starch.
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You already said the number one thing that I can't stand. Fire this customer, now.
Customer complains about garment. Wants credit/refund/you to kiss ass/etc.
Orders exactly same garment next time.
Basically when this happens inside my mind World War 3 just started and we go right to nuclear war.
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no crap, brandt is right. I don't think you'd be crazy to bill him for the re-runs of the "bad" shirts. I mean clearly he's trying to get free crap.
I will never forget the "artist" that complained about a color in a logo that was smaller than a kernel of corn saying "this is chocolate, it should be more mocha."
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Seriously id refuse to use that same garment as the previous order.
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what's even more frustrating, well two things that are super frustrating:
1. he keeps saying "other print shops are able to fix it", even though the other print shops he uses/used in town do not use discharge or waterbase ink. This still shouldn't be an issue, but the fact that he keeps trying to passive aggressively threaten us, or say other shops are willing to do it, i'm more than happy for them to do it.
2. even if i do reprint them, he is so paranoid about his work, that he'll want to buy these at a discounted rate.
drives me bonkers.
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Run away man.
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what's even more frustrating, well two things that are super frustrating:
1. he keeps saying "other print shops are able to fix it", even though the other print shops he uses/used in town do not use discharge or waterbase ink. This still shouldn't be an issue, but the fact that he keeps trying to passive aggressively threaten us, or say other shops are willing to do it, i'm more than happy for them to do it.
2. even if i do reprint them, he is so paranoid about his work, that he'll want to buy these at a discounted rate.
drives me bonkers.
1. "Like the other shops", you too now have been given some methods of, at the least, fixing this batch.
2. This concern should be rendered moot when the originals are fixed.
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i dont really care if we continue to print for this client.
what i do care about is learning why these marks are happening, and understanding how to prevent them, as well as fix them for future orders.
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We print with plastisol here. We see it on different types of shirts, on gildan tees we do not have the issue, but on for example anvil organic we do have the pressure marks. I'll lighten the pressure so much that the ink does not clear the screen and we still get them. So maybe its the way the shirt fibers are..
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BTW this is dependant on dyestuffs used. Sulphur/reactive/pigment, etc
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BTW this is dependant on dyestuffs used. Sulphur/reactive/pigment, etc
these were on next level 3600 and 3300L. I'm pretty sure they are reactive dyed, but i'm sure you could tell me better than anyone else!
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I would just wash all the shirts or was the spray method discussed and than give them back to him and pressure marks should be gone. Or is this not a solution's? I still have yet to see what your talking about? Also since your printing over a seam i bet the pressure was higher than normal. I also like how you are the only shop running discharge and water based ink in Houston! We tend to get pressure marks on that style in black especially but since our clients was the shirts the marks go away.
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They are mill dyed. Subjective term but generally refers to reactive. Simple thin styro packing material on bottom side of screen where the pressure points arm make this disappear. You are welcome ;)
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thanks Tony! between this and Danny's tips, we'll hopefully be good to go!
here is a pic from the customer. camera quality is bad.
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thats exactly what we get.
We took a damp cloth and just brushed it after.
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I'd show him the door and tell him to find another shop!! That crap is coming out on the first wash. No way I'm refunding him jack or reprinting anything for this guy especially after the first incident. Just my .02
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Agreed. He is commenting on the fibers of the shirt being pressed down and that is it. There is no actual damage or change to the integrity of the shirt. Hell you could probably use your hand to rub along the "line" and it would go away...
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I had a customer complain about this once as well, and I told him it was part of the process, and sometimes it happens due to the pressure needed to clear the ink out of the screen. What I started doing to prevent this is to cut a piece of "chip board" 2 1/2" wide x 20" and tape it to the underneath side of the screen. It absorbs most of the initial down force of the squeegee to shirt. every time I use that, I get no marks.
But Mr. R, in this case is being a bit over dramatic on this. Just my .02