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screen printing => Equipment => Topic started by: brandon on October 21, 2011, 05:27:08 PM
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Hey People,
So has anyone seen/heard/used on of these? Our neighbor embroidery company showed it to me this morning. Doesn't make sense to me as to stretch a screen with the image already exposed on it. I assume this is for the beginner screen printer. But then again before I put my big foot in my mouth I will shut up as I have been wrong many, many times. But it just looks bad and the whole process seems bad. Reminds me of that Udu thing or whatever it is called. Screen printing in minutes! Like an auto! So here is the link
http://www.goccopro.com (http://www.goccopro.com)
Anybody?
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Hey People,
So has anyone seen/heard/used on of these? Our neighbor embroidery company showed it to me this morning. Doesn't make sense to me as to stretch a screen with the image already exposed on it. I assume this is for the beginner screen printer. But then again before I put my big foot in my mouth I will shut up as I have been wrong many, many times. But it just looks bad and the whole process seems bad. Reminds me of that Udu thing or whatever it is called. Screen printing in minutes! Like an auto! So here is the link
[url]http://www.goccopro.com[/url] ([url]http://www.goccopro.com[/url])
Anybody?
checked them out at the show earlier this year. You hit the nail on the head! I walked away amazed that somebody would actually buy it . . .
pierre
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Isn't this some kind of toner-based scheme? Seems I've seen this or something like it hustled before.
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one of my "competitors" has it. . .I guess it's geared towards the green movement. . .and it's pure cheese.
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y`all got that right 8)
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it's a Yudu on steriods
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it's a Yudu on steriods
Hahahaha. Awesome. Just feel sorry for the dope that buys it
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Print Gocco was originally a little rink a dink home craft screen printing type thing
for making birthday cards and the like. Kind of cool actually. Came with flash bulbs
for exposing the "screens". Found one at a thrift store a few years back. The nicer
ones actually go for a chunk of change.
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It is the same crap that xpresscreen sells.... but different. When we first got into the industry we looked at xpresscreen because we liked the no chemicals claim. We talked to several different people that had xpresscreen and we were told to run far away from them. Looks like the mesh is the same stuff just exposed differently but similar. One person said that it distorts the image when you put the mesh in the frames. If it is too good to be true.......
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Really? I manage a successful printing company that solely uses the goccopro. Haters gonna hate. Lets first dive into the difference between traditional screen printing and the goccopro printing. Traditional printing takes a week to produce a screen not to mention the harsh chemicals. I'm talking nose bleeds through the respirator and burning eyes. Ok you got the screen, oh no! The screen is messed up, add on another week to make a new screen. I print out the screens in less than a minute. Oh no a mistake, reprint a new one. easy. I can do a job same day, and without the labor costs associated with exposing washing and letting dry the traditional way. You still get the same end product. Don't knock it till you try it. I stand by my machine 100%. Sure it's expensive to start with but it pays off, much like buying a press. You pay thousands but it pays off. There are secrets and tips to this like everything else. People quit when they find one little problem instead of finding a solution. You can't rely on "hear say" to make a decision. I have a great relationship with XPRESSSCREEN. I have been a pioneer in the exploration of this Goccopro's abilities. They look to me to find and fix potential problems. Have a problem? Ask. I have probably encountered it and solved it. "One person said that it distorts the image when you put the mesh in the frames." yes some of the early early machines did have that problem but that has since been resolved. It was an issue with the gears and belt. I had that problem, I informed XPRESSCREEN about it, and they sent me a brand new machine. I have been running this thing for 2 years now without any issue. Traditional screen printing is a thing of the past. Why would you dig a hole with a shovel if you have a backhoe? Goccopro is the way of the future.
Good Day,
Amanda
Manager of Quick Screen Print
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ing. Traditional printing takes a week to produce a screen
Now if I could get all my customers to believe that I'd never have to worry about a rush job again.
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I couldn't read your whole reply, but a week to make a screen? Then, if it's wrong, it takes another week to make a new one? Really? That kills your credibility altogether you know... We make about 50 a day here, in fact, we can stretch a new screen, process it and have it ready to print in about an hour or just over. To claim a week is seriously wrong. I suspect you're just not fully aware of how industrial screen printers work. Even at my first job in the early seventies we made about 20 a day... good luck to you though.
Steve
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Really? I manage a successful printing company that solely uses the goccopro. Haters gonna hate. Lets first dive into the difference between traditional screen printing and the goccopro printing. Traditional printing takes a week to produce a screen not to mention the harsh chemicals. I'm talking nose bleeds through the respirator and burning eyes. Ok you got the screen, oh no! The screen is messed up, add on another week to make a new screen. I print out the screens in less than a minute. Oh no a mistake, reprint a new one. easy. I can do a job same day, and without the labor costs associated with exposing washing and letting dry the traditional way. You still get the same end product. Don't knock it till you try it. I stand by my machine 100%. Sure it's expensive to start with but it pays off, much like buying a press. You pay thousands but it pays off. There are secrets and tips to this like everything else. People quit when they find one little problem instead of finding a solution. You can't rely on "hear say" to make a decision. I have a great relationship with XPRESSSCREEN. I have been a pioneer in the exploration of this Goccopro's abilities. They look to me to find and fix potential problems. Have a problem? Ask. I have probably encountered it and solved it. "One person said that it distorts the image when you put the mesh in the frames." yes some of the early early machines did have that problem but that has since been resolved. It was an issue with the gears and belt. I had that problem, I informed XPRESSCREEN about it, and they sent me a brand new machine. I have been running this thing for 2 years now without any issue. Traditional screen printing is a thing of the past. Why would you dig a hole with a shovel if you have a backhoe? Goccopro is the way of the future.
Good Day,
Amanda
Manager of Quick Screen Print
Hi Amanda,
welcome to the board!
As you might have noticed, this post was started three years ago and things could easily be much better now. As one of the first posters and somebody who's seen the unit first hand (few years back), it was not really set up for mass production or high end work. Our tolerances when registering simulated process prints are down to few thousands of an inch and that is hard to achieve with a low tension mesh and trying to stretch a preburned image on a screen. Slight misalignment would prevent us from being able to register the job. As far as the tension, printing multicolor wet on wet at a reasonable production rates is difficult unless the screens are at 20N or more.
There are right tools for every job, and this unit seems to work well for you and is possibly a good choice for ppl in your position. For most of us here, the original design is not a good fit. You mention improvements have been made, can you let us know more about it? Are they able to hold higher tension now? Is there a way to ensure the stencil is not deformed when placing on the frame?
please let us know!
thanx,
pierre
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lolwut.
I have been making screens for 7 years without using a respirator and never had a nose bleed. Coating a screen takes about 20 seconds, drying time is 1-2 hours, during which you can do other things, exposing and washout is maybe 5 minutes. If it takes you a week, you're doing something wrong. This is all irrelevant as you are ignoring efficiency based on quantity. You can make 100s of screens a day with proper equipment, and many shops do this every day.
The Xpress screen equipment is meant for very simple designs being printed in very small quantities. Traditional screens can last for 10's of thousands of prints and print with very high detail and many colors with perfect registration using lots of different ink types, and do so very, very quickly. The time it takes to print a screen, tighten it on the frame, and line up a multicolor design using this system would make it less efficient than creating and setting up screens in even a small production oriented shop. The cost of throwing away and recreating screens each time would also cost more than the material costs involved in creating a screen in the traditional way, considering the mesh is reusable hundreds or thousands of times. Essentially, a system like this may be more efficient and easy for someone making a few shirts in their dorm room, but it is not viable for an efficient and profitable business. There is a reason DTG and every new gimmicky technology has not simply replaced traditional screen printing...
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Traditional screen printing is a thing of the past.
Goccopro is the way of the future.
Thank you.. I haven't laughed that hard in quite some time.
if this is you..
http://quickscreenprint.com/ (http://quickscreenprint.com/)
you say no harsh chemicals.. i see screen opener on the shelf behind you ancient blue max manual,.. that stuff is about the most toxic stuff in the biz beside caustic screen opener.
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But John, it says they have the "Latest state-of-the-art "direct to screen" technology." so it must be true
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Barth..........you have all the toys, don't tell us you don't have a few of these.
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Direct from their site.
What is Screen Printing?
Traditional Method
Traditional screen printing is best described as a process by which ink is pushed through a very fine screen onto a surface, such as a t-shirt or some paper mesh. To achieve the desired image, the artwork is first designed on a computer and printed onto special paper. The image is then exposed onto a screen which is coated in a light sensitive chemical. After air drying, the light sensitive coating can be washed out with water, exposing the image on the screen. The screen must then be set out to cure, which hardens the coating - this process is sometimes referred to as exposing or burning the screen. Once this 5 day process is complete, you are ready to push ink through the screen. Once the entire job is completed you must strip the coating off, a process that involves very harsh chemicals which, even with a respirator, cause nose bleeds.
What disturbs me about this is miseducation of customers and flat out making what we do look bad by bold faced lying. It is obviously a marketing ploy to take away from their competitors but man straight up lying? Nose Bleeds? WTF! Screens are reclaimed with diluted periodic acid.Tho hazardous in pure form its safe to work with and far from causing nose bleeds. And BTW companies like New Buffalo make 300+ screens a day with ease.
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It's state of the art. You KNOW I gots it!
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If my screen guy asks for a raise, I'm going to tell him he's not working hard enough. I've never even seen his nose bleed.
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Direct from their site.
What is Screen Printing?
Traditional Method
Traditional screen printing is best described as a process by which ink is pushed through a very fine screen onto a surface, such as a t-shirt or some paper mesh. To achieve the desired image, the artwork is first designed on a computer and printed onto special paper. The image is then exposed onto a screen which is coated in a light sensitive chemical. After air drying, the light sensitive coating can be washed out with water, exposing the image on the screen. The screen must then be set out to cure, which hardens the coating - this process is sometimes referred to as exposing or burning the screen. Once this 5 day process is complete, you are ready to push ink through the screen. Once the entire job is completed you must strip the coating off, a process that involves very harsh chemicals which, even with a respirator, cause nose bleeds.
What disturbs me about this is miseducation of customers and flat out making what we do look bad by bold faced lying. It is obviously a marketing ploy to take away from their competitors but man straight up lying? Nose Bleeds? WTF! Screens are reclaimed with diluted periodic acid.Tho hazardous in pure form its safe to work with and far from causing nose bleeds. And BTW companies like New Buffalo make 300+ screens a day with ease.
Wow, I've been all wrong for most of my life... I glad I saw this, now I can start over... Holy Sh!t that's funny. I wonder if this person has ever even seen a real shop...
Steve
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Direct from their site.
What is Screen Printing?
Traditional Method
Traditional screen printing is best described as a process by which ink is pushed through a very fine screen onto a surface, such as a t-shirt or some paper mesh. To achieve the desired image, the artwork is first designed on a computer and printed onto special paper. The image is then exposed onto a screen which is coated in a light sensitive chemical. After air drying, the light sensitive coating can be washed out with water, exposing the image on the screen. The screen must then be set out to cure, which hardens the coating - this process is sometimes referred to as exposing or burning the screen. Once this 5 day process is complete, you are ready to push ink through the screen. Once the entire job is completed you must strip the coating off, a process that involves very harsh chemicals which, even with a respirator, cause nose bleeds.
What disturbs me about this is miseducation of customers and flat out making what we do look bad by bold faced lying. It is obviously a marketing ploy to take away from their competitors but man straight up lying? Nose Bleeds? WTF! Screens are reclaimed with diluted periodic acid.Tho hazardous in pure form its safe to work with and far from causing nose bleeds. And BTW companies like New Buffalo make 300+ screens a day with ease.
maybe someone was doing lines of emulsion remover powder?
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maybe someone was doing lines of emulsion remover powder?
crap, I shouldn't be doing that?
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Maybe I should try post exposing my screens for 5 days instead of 5 minutes for discharge....
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They are in the Milwaukee area. Next time I'm up that way I'll have to see if I can sneak in and steal some of their trade secrets. Sounds like a cutting edge company.
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Haters gonna hate :)
I think the traditional screen printer should take notice of this state of the art technology and incorporate it into their business model and after a few months it will probably take over as the main source of production. It seems like it is gonna dominate our industry in years to come and if most of us don't get on board we will be passed up by this GOCCOPRO thing.
<Faught noise here>
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what's sad is the amount of misinformation blasted all over their website John posted up. nose bleeds? wtf?
someday, this person defending the goochie coochie pro or wtf it's called is going go "AHHH that's what those guys where talking about"....
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Yall just jealous M&R didn't make it first ;D ;D all funnin aside they have regular screen print equipment I saw in there shop and they still believe it takes that long to burn screens Ha they must still be using the old stuff and I don't think it took that long, but hey do what makes you money ::)
darryl
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what's sad is the amount of misinformation blasted all over their website John posted up. nose bleeds? wtf?
someday, this person defending the goochie coochie pro or wtf it's called is going go "AHHH that's what those guys where talking about"....
That's the shame of the tone of thread after she joined in. She may not want to continue to look into the details of our standard methods (or the newest advances in auto coating and DTS.)
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I'll agree Andy, that the tone went to pretty much blasting this person as being incredibly ignorant, as opposed to being kind and understanding about it, but the arrogance of their response is what made that happen. I hope they do finally respond to what's being written. Maybe this person should read Danny G's post about 45K shirts last week with 700 screens produced. Where would someone with a decent startup dryer and press get so much totally incorrect information? And then put it on their website as if it's the gospel, and not expect some blowback? Who is selling them supplies and no information on the trade? They are just so misinformed/ignorant (same thing of course) and it makes them look really bad to anyone with knowledge of the field... I'd like to see them reply, so's to get some real help from all of us here; it's what we do everyday, help each other...
Steve
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Yep, the tone was on both sides. We tend to get very defensive about our loyalties.
I have no doubt that these proprietary systems work great for some shops, whether the best/most-bang-for-the-buck/easiest/ or any of the multitude of other qualities by which we judge
We can all agree, however (at least all here, and the poster eventually) that the statements made in the product's promotion are ludicrous at best, but we have all gotten pretty used to outrageous claims and/or poor comparisons made in many ads.
A few years ago, I was asked by my father to offer advice to a friend's sandal company that was screen printing their soles, and was rebuffed immediately when I questioned their use of the Xpress system. It's all they knew, and they weren't about to get caught up in the "expensive, complicated, and messy system so common in other shops"
The Frogmobile 3000
Higher mileage than a Humvee!
Higher performance than a Smart car!
Higher level of interior comfort and ride quality than a Jeep Wrangler!
(at least, compared to these jokers, my claims are a little more accurate, though the comparisons are still silly)
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Where would someone with a decent startup dryer and press get so much totally incorrect information? And then put it on their website as if it's the gospel, and not expect some blowback? Who is selling them supplies and no information on the trade? They are just so misinformed/ignorant (same thing of course) and it makes them look really bad to anyone with knowledge of the field..
Steve
That's what I wondered. And outside of that, don't they do any research? I would think just thumbing through a few trade mags /websites you would actually learn that 90% of their die hard info is wrong...even reading a few posts here would disprove the "week long exposure".....although you can't believe everything you read on the interwebs..... :P
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I had to take another look at the goccopro unit, after thinking it thru it does have a place in the screen print world maybe not high production, but 1 to a few doz shirts on a manual yes. I know the guy said it would do multiple colors but I'm having a problem believing that seeing that you tension the screen with the image on it, but still I can see it being useful in a smaller shop or to knock out very simple low pc one to two color jobs.
darryl
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I cant see how it would be more efficient or optimal to do a different process from normal screen prep for small runs, and on top of that you lose control over a lot of variables like eom. The only place I see this working is in a situation where someone doesnt have the ability to make screens in a standard way like in a dorm room or a shared office type of situation, or they are just starting out and have no idea what to do. I successfully made screens with less than $100 of equipment in a bathroom in a rental house for almost 2 years without issue. For a while I had 4 total screens and used them over and over and over. Having to toss the mesh each time seems more expensive as well...
I think the tone in the thread is pretty much entirely a reaction to the "nosebleed" comment. It's pretty offensive to imply that what all of us do everyday makes people sick and that we wouldn't have done the research to find an alternative if faced with that kind of reality. If I got a nosebleed from making a screen I sure as hell would change something...
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I got a nosebleed from making screens today.
Trying to put on in my rack above my head, it slipped out of my hand and whacked me in the face.
Worst part is I bled on the wet emulsion. Now not only do I have a swollen and tender nose, I have to call a customer and tell them its going to take another week to remake their screen.*
Mondays rock!
*According to some sources
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If anyone would forego the traditional method (when they have the screens, press, ability, etc.) and do a job using the Gocco instead then they should have their head examined. The only scenario this makes sense is for those who don't have any better equipment. The fact that she is using this thing instead of the other equipment in her shop pics that were on her website tells me a ton, which I won't get into.
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If anyone would forego the traditional method (when they have the screens, press, ability, etc.) and do a job using the Gocco instead then they should have their head examined. The only scenario this makes sense is for those who don't have any better equipment. The fact that she is using this thing instead of the other equipment in her shop pics that were on her website tells me a ton, which I won't get into.
you mean the knockoff harley shirts?
LOL.
Wonder how HD would feel about those
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I'm a little curious about claims of "zero carbon footprint" with these disposable stencil/mesh panels as well.
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And the uncured plastisol that is left on the "mesh" they are throwing away.