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General => General Discussion and ??? => Topic started by: Sbrem on August 07, 2017, 01:21:25 PM
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OK, I have a new contract customer, that needs the whitest white we can get, which is 2 print plastisol, PFP. We did an assortment of mesh combinations, and he chose the 110S PFP. I think some of us are cringing at that probably. However, the customer is going to heat press all of them, himself. He likes what he's getting, so we won't argue with him. He originally came up with a vinyl (OK, polyurethane) transfer, and needless to say, it was perfect white and soft as can be. Enough background; he can still ever so slightly see a few black fibers, and wants to know if he washed them dried them first if that would help "remove the excess fibers". I told I thought it would probably cause fibrillation, making it worse. What do you folks think? Thanks...
Steve
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Steve depending on the press and squeegee selection 110/f/110 works in some cases( I may be the lone ranger here that didn't cringe). we tend to use the roller after the flash now and it really helps things out with w/f/w.
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What about just a dry, no wash?
Are you using a lint screen?
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Washing/Agitating the fabric will release more fibers and make the garment fuzzier.
Now you have to fight those fibers and get them to lay down. A tougher job now than it should be.
As said, a rolling screen will work wonders for this. But, its still not perfect. We have seen some garments here still have fibers pop up.... but the garment was a headache to begin with.
The smoother a shirt is to begin with. The fewer/no fibers will pop up.
This a good case for the M&R iron or the one from ROQ.
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wasn't there a fiber lock additive some time ago that really helped fibrillation.
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That helps when washed.
I.e. Put it in black ink on white shirts and it helps the fibers stay trapped under and in the ink layer.
Plus it has a harder hand.
What Sbrem wants is to have an ink surface with zero shirt fibers visible at all. As I understand it.
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That helps when washed.
I.e. Put it in black ink on white shirts and it helps the fibers stay trapped under and in the ink layer.
Plus it has a harder hand.
What Sbrem wants is to have an ink surface with zero shirt fibers visible at all. As I understand it.
Yeah, that's pretty much it; it's being compared to vinyl. As for the roller, I believe we will get one, we've put it off as it hasn't been a problem, but I also think the roller will be best. And yes, we do use a lint screen. Actually I don't mind a bit of fiber here and there, and it has to be a foot from your face to tell, which the customer understands, but he is willing to pay for what it takes. He will do the heat pressing, which maybe he'll give up on after a couple of thouand of them. For what it's worth, we made him 150 PFP, 110S PFP, 110s under/150s on top, and 150s on the bottom with the 110s on top.
Steve
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Print three whites. 150 and a couple 230's and you will still have a shirt that's reasonably soft.
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HSA would be the best fit, closest print I've seen to a transfer finish, superior mat down and brightest white. 3 screens likely in this case, recommend the Matsui product. Email me if ya need more info.
Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
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HSA would be the best fit, closest print I've seen to a transfer finish, superior mat down and brightest white. 3 screens likely in this case, recommend the Matsui product. Email me if ya need more info.
Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
Oddly enough, he has asked for 3 whites, and he's still going to heat press them himself. As for HSA, the last time we tried it, it froze in the screen immediately. I imagine it's improved since we tried it. My staff has plastisol stuck in their heads, they cry and whine like crazy over any WB, and it's crazy hard to find help as most of us know...
Steve
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HSA would be the best fit, closest print I've seen to a transfer finish, superior mat down and brightest white. 3 screens likely in this case, recommend the Matsui product. Email me if ya need more info.
Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
This was going to be my suggestion. I'd also like to through some Polyurethane HSA into the mix as well as an option. Doesn't dry as fast, but it does climb the squeegee pretty bad.
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How about High density> 2 layers
200 micron 110 mesh
flash
200 micron 180 mesh for smoothness
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If the customer is heat pressing after why not just go straight to transfers?
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discharge underbase with 230 on the top will give you the paper white print and it will be soft.
pierre
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We have a hot head Iron and it makes it super smooth... two 110's with white and you can see the mesh pattern in there... virtually no fibres and super even.
before the hot head I would use a very fine mist of H20 and spritz the shirt, then manually flatten the fibres with my hands all in one direction. Super DIY but it used to solve the really bad shirts fibrillation problems. At least until you get your roller ;)
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A lot of great answers folks, thanks. Where's the lead in the ink when we really need it? :D
Steve
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discharge underbase with 230 on the top will give you the paper white print and it will be soft.
pierre
That was one of our 1st attempts, a plasticharge white base through a 150S, with a 150S plastisol on top, but the Next Level 3600 didn't discharge well enough, a G2000 came out better. Would you be thinking a discharge base, with less than usual amount of white so the plastisol sticks better? We know the plasticharge works with plastisol on top, and I've read enough on this here (this came up sometime in the last year, and it was said to use a regular DC base, with less than the usual amount of white) to know that might be the way...
Steve
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Kudos to all of you - haven't printed in a while and the options/recommendations discussed are clear and the willingness to share this info speaks well of all of you - thanks
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We will use some lower mesh counts that most will cringe at but our main mesh for what you're talking about would be a 120/54 printed one stroke, 35-40"/sec, flash, one stroke fast again. Most of our customers want the white to look like it does in the bucket and printing with 180's and 225's never satisfies most of them. And some that we'll do a 150 flash 150 and see a few tiny shades of fibers don't like it when I think it's damn near a perfect print with bright white and very thin deposit. I'm always creeping our mesh counts higher and higher until a customer complains then we'll go back down and start all over again.
Have you maxed out your print stroke yet? How are you flooding? Filling the stencil or just flooding? You should be able to get the stark white look with higher mesh counts when you get a good ink that will shear with high speed.
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We're running them now, 81, double stroke, flash, 110S double stroke. It's pretty damn white. We did multiple samples last week, and this was the one he liked the most. Still, there was the ever so slight "evidence" of the shirt fiber, but since the customer is heat pressing them all before packaging (he took unpressed samples and heat pressed them with his own equipment) he knows what he's getting. Normal flood, enough to fill the mesh, but certainly not over-filled. I almost want to use a bullet nosed squeegee, which sounds crazy, but worked like you wouldn't believe when my old shop did a gigantic order for Burger King and Coca-Cola. 4XX mesh, bullet-nosed squeegee, one stroke. Triangle Ink, circa 1980. When a guy recommended it to me, I said "absolutely no way" but was proved wrong when I put it to the test. The biggest problem was the 4XX mesh, which was only good for about 5000 prints. The run was 150K, and the screens were hand stretched and stapled, about 30 of them...
Steve