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screen printing => General Screen Printing => Topic started by: Nation03 on December 06, 2011, 07:45:58 PM
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I'm still home based at the moment, but I'm scouting out places to rent as things become busier. There is one of those industrial/warehouse complexes close to my house that have multiple units that would be perfect. My question is, are you allowed to modify the plumbing in these places? Because I would obviously like to put in a slop sink next to my washout booth so I have something to pump the water into from my filtration unit. I know nothing about plumbing, but is that a complicated thing to setup/get rid of if I were to leave the space down the road? Thanks in advance.
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It all depends on the landlord. Usually not a big deal but the landlord and/or city may require the work be done by licensed (expensive) plumbers.
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Okay, cool. Thank you!
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Buyers (or renters) market right now. Take a tour, tell them you're interested, but for it to work
you would need such and such plumbing and electricity etc. Most landlords are more than happy
to shell out for a one time improvement if it means a signed lease.
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Sounds good, thanks. I honestly have no experience with buying or renting a place, so I appreciate the help. Still need to build a more consistent client base before I move out of the basement, but we'll see where 2012 takes us.
Thanks again.
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Be sure you have enough electrical capacity and also enough room. I am in a 900 sq ft building and really should have been at least double that for expansion and all around production comfort. Also make sure to know what is included in the rent. In my spot the only extra I pay is about 35 dollars every 2 or 3 months for water/garbage
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Being up in Northern NJ you shouldn't have a problem as long as the Land lord or property manager is ok with it. You will want to set it up so it can be removed without damaging the plumbing when you leave. Usually the lease states everything needs to be back the way it was when you received the space. Your biggest issue is going to be can you access the hot/cold water and sewer to attach your lines without cutting into walls or worse yet the floor. The space I'm in now the pump out for the washout booth has to move the water straight up 9' then a horizontal run of 20' in order to connect to a sewer line without having to cut into a wall.
Make sure the space will be big enough for what your intentions are for at least the term of the lease. Also make sure the electric service is large enough and the circuit breaker box has enough empty slots to connect your equipment. Single or three phase. Does the place have gas service for heat and possibly a gas dryer. Is there a door big enough to get the equipment through.
When the time comes a few more things to think about. Make sure you have "first right of refusal" to any of the spaces adjacent to the one your looking at. In other words they have to offer you the vacant space before they can put it up for lease, gives you a chance to expand if necessary. Cam charges and or maintenance fees, who is paying for what like snow plowing, landscaping, maintenance, etc and how is it paid out. Type and amount of insurance you need. Who is responsible for what. Do you need a variance from the town or county to operate your business at the location. There is a lot to consider and review before signing on the dotted line. Always have a third party (not necessarily an lawyer) look over the lease before hand, in all the excitement of the new space you tend to overlook things that may have catastrophic effects down the road.
Just my $0.05
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Awesome information, thank you!
The space I'm looking at is about 2500 sqft. Has a drive in door and a tailgate. My boss's place is on the second floor of a building, and it is a nice space, but his other business is starting to take up too much room in the printing area. The offer is on the table if I want to rent from him for a while when he calls it quits with the printing business, but I'm not interested in paying rent, yet having to store all his overflowed stuff/equipment from the biz upstairs. I think his floor is 2800 sqft, but there are pillars splitting it up and a bunch of man made partitions, so I figured an open 2500 sqft place will be fine for at least a few years. Probably be suitable for a while since I don't see myself getting more then 1 automatic down the road. I'm pretty sure the rent is $2500 not including gas/electric, but it isn't stated.
Anyway, thanks again. You brought up a ton of questions that I'll definitely be writing down and saving for the day we go warehouse hunting. I always knew a lot went into find a place, but I have a better grasp on the things I need to consider now.
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$2500 is alot of money for an industrial space but I guess it depends on your locale. Rent rates around my parts are between .35-.50 cents a foot
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I won't find anything that cheap around here. I live in Bergen County, NJ... very ritzy county a few miles from Manhattan. The only way I'll find cheap places is if I go into the ghetto areas and it isn't worth it around here because they are a guaranteed flood zone and no one wants to deal with the businesses in those areas... not even the people that live in those areas lol. Even though I have practically no overhead right now, I estimate it to be $5000 a month just to be safe. Ideally I'll end up buying a building down the road, I don't want to rent forever.
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If you're OK with spending 5 g's a month, why don't you buy?
Check with the landlord about the plumbing, but, also check with codes in your area. Let's say the landlord says, "OK whatever you need" Then the city inspector comes in and says you have to do whatever. The landlord says "you are doing it, fix it!"
If you have an agreement with the landlord it must be in writing. If it isn't written down and agreed to it means nothing in Real Estate. As defined, "real estate is a bundel of rights" Verbal agrements mean nothing!
Back to buying.
I don't know your market, but. It is an industrial area. Not retail. Not a drive by. No foot traffic. If you are not depending on these issues I'd be surprised if you couldn't purchase a building someplace that does not offer these same aminities. For 5 grand a month couldn't you spend about $200,000.00? At 5.5% interest that's just $1,135.58 a month. Why buy someone elses building, buy your own.
Just my .02
Terry
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In Orlando, slop (or service) sinks could not be on a septic system. Sewer only. Made a difference when I was looking for a place. The unit I ended up in had a second bathroom in the back warehouse part, and they let me pull out their sink and install my washout sink, as long as I put everything back when I vacated. I had a tarp on the floor to keep the splashback off. It had cheap paneling, so I covered the walls with clear plastic. When I moved out the place looked like it did when I moved in. They also let me run a new 220v line in conduit for my dryer, without pulling a permit, subject to inspection by their building manager. He looked in the box, then we bullsh!tted for 15 minutes.
The one caveat with the plumbing was, I was responsible for maintenance, and if the sewer line got plugged up, I'd have to foot the bill for a cleanout. I always stuff some washable furnace filter material in my sink drain to catch the chunks anyway, and so far have never had a drainage problem.
Check local code. Explain your (hopefully) drain-safe chemical use to the landlord. Most landlords don't like to see a potential tenant walk away.
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Also, buildings and complexes in general are usually suited to either manufacturing or distribution. As we're
technically a light manufacturing process, either will typically work, though a manufacturing building will have better
power and drainage.
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I think $2500.00 for 2500 feet is high, but of course it depends where you are. I'm in Mass., 3K for 7500 feet... no utilities except common electric for outlets.
Steve
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I have 8,000 sqft and it only costs me $1500 a month, and im not sharing space or anything with anyone.
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I have 8,000 sqft and it only costs me $1500 a month, and im not sharing space or anything with anyone.
DAYUM! I was shelling out $1150 for 1250 sf. I also had to sign a "morality" addendum saying I wouldn't open a titty bar, tattoo parlor, massage parlor, adult bookstore or marital aid emporium on the premises.
Needless to say, that shot Plan B right out the window. ;)
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I wish I had not signed a 2 year lease. In our are there is a bunch of really nice 3-5000 sq ft spaces for 1000-1500 a month
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I have 8,000 sqft and it only costs me $1500 a month, and im not sharing space or anything with anyone.
DAYUM! I was shelling out $1150 for 1250 sf. I also had to sign a "morality" addendum saying I wouldn't open a titty bar, tattoo parlor, massage parlor, adult bookstore or marital aid emporium on the premises.
Needless to say, that shot Plan B right out the window. ;)
Loading dock, UPS bay, 6,300 warehouse and 1700 offices. All heated and offices AC'ed 400 amp service. Gas already was here. Happy with it. I think I am going to buy the joint.
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$1 a sq ft here in Seattle. We have a big warehouse. Sucks! And moving again next year to a larger one
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Was $1/sqft in our old place (1500). We're in 2500 now at $0.65. Which is a pretty slick deal
around here. I'm not one much for haggling but when it comes to real estate it's almost
necessary.
Moving to Georgia.
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Was $1/sqft in our old place (1500). We're in 2500 now at $0.65. Which is a pretty slick deal
around here. I'm not one much for haggling but when it comes to real estate it's almost
necessary.
Moving to Georgia.
Hey,
Y'all are in Oakland huh? I think I may have driven past your shop last year. My wife's sister lives in Oakland. Yeah, not cheap. Could not imagine what a shop over in SF cost. Is there even any there? Is Cinderblock still around?
And yeah, I want to move back to New Orleans! Super cheap!
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Seems like any buildings near big cities is going to be in that $1/sqft range. Since I'm in the greater NYC area everything I look at is $1+. But my boss found an awesome deal on a 4800 sqft building. Guy is selling it for $200k. He wants to buy it and let me rent it out from him, but he's having cash flow issues with his new business. Hopefully we can work something out though, I want to get out of my basement lol.
$1500 for 8000 sqft?! wow, benefits of the south I suppose. My boss saw a place in georgia - 10,000 sqft for $900 a month.. guess thats why most of the big contract shops are in the south.. we'd never be able to compete on a contract basis with anyone in the south. We have been getting a few decent wholesale accounts that want to stay local though.
The town with the complex I was looking at is a pretty rich/snobby town... so I don't even know if a print shop is allowed, but I have no clue on the rules/regulations that area. Guess I need to call the town.
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A few notes:
Think of what you need now, and what the shop might need if business takes off. Square footage is important, but it's not everything. You'll be surprised at what you can do with high ceilings that are found in the suites of most industrial parks. (think: loft storage, high shelves, etc)
Some points:
Plumbing and water source. One of the easy ways to put in a washout sink is look for a place where the bathroom has been added to the shop space in one corner. Tap into the water and drain from the adjoining wall. Done.
Ask if it's septic or municipal. THIS IS IMPORTANT. Some septic systems cannot handle the reclaiming output from a busy shop.
Make sure there is adequate water supply for most any pressure washer. (look for 2 gallons/minute or better)
Electrical. Gonna have an electric dryer? Make sure you have a big panel, at least 100 amps three phase. Planning on an auto? 200 amps. Not gonna have either? Look for a space with that kind of electrical potential anyway. It costs nothing to not use it. It costs a pile of money to have it installed later on if/when you need it.
Ventilation. Ask the landlord if punching a hole in the ceiling or wall is ok. This isn't an option, most any dryer ever made will need an exhaust vent.
Gas line. If you are going for a gas dryer, (now or down the road) you'll need it. If you are heating the entire space, you will want it.
Smooth floors. If they are cracked and rough, it's a pain in the ass.
Screen room. If a space has a small built in room that can be made clean, dry and dark, (aside from the bathroom) bonus. Doesn't have to be big, a 5x10 closet would even work.
Lighting. Lots of it. Skylights rule. Low hanging fleuro fixtures rule.
Noise restrictions. Screen printing shops are noisy. Ask about the neighbors.
Speaking of neighbors, check the adjoining businesses. Some are NOT ok to have next door to a screen printing shop. For instance, a tile/stone shop that produces copious amounts of dust. Google the address and check out all the neighbors.
Permits and licenses. Make SURE the space allows industrial work. Go to the city/county office and ask them about any use permits you might need in that location. Do that BEFORE you sign any lease. Don't assume that because it's in an "industrial" park that your business is allowed within the confines of local permitting laws.
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Loading dock, UPS bay, 6,300 warehouse and 1700 offices. All heated and offices AC'ed 400 amp service. Gas already was here. Happy with it. I think I am going to buy the joint.
I hate you.
:)
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Loading dock, UPS bay, 6,300 warehouse and 1700 offices. All heated and offices AC'ed 400 amp service. Gas already was here. Happy with it. I think I am going to buy the joint.
I hate you.
:)
(http://www.graphicdisorder.com/bstuff/gifs/bounce.gif)
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Good info Evo, thanks!
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Have you figured out how much extra business you will have to do in a year just to make the same profit as you do now?....
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Yeah. Like I said, I still don't have the volume or enough cash flow to get a place yet. My website has only been up for a few months and I am getting a good response from it. I'm finally starting to see some progression once I really started trying to market.. I can still do better though. I think what's going to end up happening is my boss will most likely get a second location and have me run it. He'll source is printing out to me and I can run my own jobs. We'll see what happens.