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screen printing => Newbie => Topic started by: spencer_L&KC on August 04, 2025, 11:36:17 AM
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My shop is very small, manual only, running an 18"x24" BBC Black Flash. We are working on an Anatol Thunder that has 16"x22" pallets. We have a lot of customers who want large prints. When printing say a 15" x 20" print, it takes the the flash a good 8-10 secs to get those top and bottom parts of the print dry enough for the next color. In an effort to keep the press moving efficiently, without having to wait longer than needed, or having to print/flash again because we moved along to quickly on one of them, we count the time needed for each flash. When printing I am usually listening to music and that makes counting in my head or out loud difficult to stay accurate.
Our solution is using the stopwatch functionality on an iphone. We print the first color and when we swing that pallet under the flash with one hand, we start the timer with the other. While that is counting we are printing the next garment and when the time reaches where we want it, we swing the carousel for the next garment, and repeat by resetting and restarting the stopwatch. Using the stopwatch gives us a visual of where we are at for each flash and print stroke, keeping things very uniform and easily repeated. We are sort of tired of using the iphone and have been looking for a touch screen timer or stopwatch dedicated for this purpose only, but before we bother buying anything, I thought I would ask how others are counting their flash times.
I understand that most on here are probably working with quartz flashes, which have built in timers, but for those of you still working with infrared panel flashes, how do you count to get accurate repetitive flash times?
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Even thought we have an auto press we still use our manual press from time to time, very simple for me once the flash is good and hot my print strokes is my count, so how every long it take's me to print a shirt it's flashing plus I set my flash about 2 inches over the pallet or adjust the height for whatever I'm printing.
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Even thought we have an auto press we still use our manual press from time to time, very simple for me once the flash is good and hot my print strokes is my count, so how every long it take's me to print a shirt it's flashing plus I set my flash about 2 inches over the pallet or adjust the height for whatever I'm printing.
So basically youre adjusting your flash temp and distance so that the flash takes as long as the print stroke takes to flood and print, with maybe another "stencil clearing" second stroke? Dont you ever experience times when your print stroke is faster or slower than others? Do you ever get parts of the print still wet because you went faster on a print stroke, resulting in the garment sticking or opacity suffering? Since I have been using a timer, I know for sure there are times when some print strokes are faster than others, by 2-3 seconds, which can be a considerable difference when flashing.
I guess I am a bit OCD, hence the timer. If it takes 8 seconds to flash a print between colors, then I want each flash to be 8 seconds exactly. If I didnt time it, I am positive I would be getting some flashes at 6 or 7 seconds, resulting in less than desired results. My goal is the most consistent prints, shirt to shirt.
Or maybe I am taking the "it needs to be dry but still tacky" too seriously. Maybe I should just run the flash a little warmer and not worry as much about it staying tacky, so long as its not under there a long time coming close to curing the ink.
Thanks for the reply!
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I think you really need to get a larger flash, for these bigger prints. IR is fine once heated up, but you need it a couple of inches larger than the print in both directions, minimum.
We only use 20x24" flashes here even though we almost always print 14" wide max. We do print up to 16.5" wide with the larger screens too though.
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I think you really need to get a larger flash, for these bigger prints. IR is fine once heated up, but you need it a couple of inches larger than the print in both directions, minimum.
We only use 20x24" flashes here even though we almost always print 14" wide max. We do print up to 16.5" wide with the larger screens too though.
Which flash do you have that is 20"x24"? I don't think BBC makes that sizes, the next size up is 24"x24". I am interested in quartz, but the next upgrade is a larger dryer.
My 18"x24" which is actually more like 17"x23" panel, does seem to fit the "couple of inches larger than the print" bill already though. My max print size is 15"x20".
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17x23 is decently big and should work well actually. We have M&R quartz flashes, all 20x24. I remember our earlier smaller IR flashes being problematic with top / bottom or sides flashing and solved it a long time ago with bigger flashes, so thought it was the same issue.
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I'll add that when you are maxing out print area with an IR flash the slightest breeze can cause issue.
As for timing like another poster said it's really just a matter of getting in the groove, it's been a looonnnggg time since I've manually
printed but I don't recall ever counting.
I think over-flashing is a bit of a myth as well, never had washing issues where top colors were coming off from a base.
As long as your dryer is at right temp/dwell you're re-melting everything anyways.
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Even thought we have an auto press we still use our manual press from time to time, very simple for me once the flash is good and hot my print strokes is my count, so how every long it take's me to print a shirt it's flashing plus I set my flash about 2 inches over the pallet or adjust the height for whatever I'm printing.
So basically youre adjusting your flash temp and distance so that the flash takes as long as the print stroke takes to flood and print, with maybe another "stencil clearing" second stroke? Dont you ever experience times when your print stroke is faster or slower than others? Do you ever get parts of the print still wet because you went faster on a print stroke, resulting in the garment sticking or opacity suffering? Since I have been using a timer, I know for sure there are times when some print strokes are faster than others, by 2-3 seconds, which can be a considerable difference when flashing.
I guess I am a bit OCD, hence the timer. If it takes 8 seconds to flash a print between colors, then I want each flash to be 8 seconds exactly. If I didnt time it, I am positive I would be getting some flashes at 6 or 7 seconds, resulting in less than desired results. My goal is the most consistent prints, shirt to shirt.
Or maybe I am taking the "it needs to be dry but still tacky" too seriously. Maybe I should just run the flash a little warmer and not worry as much about it staying tacky, so long as its not under there a long time coming close to curing the ink.
Thanks for the reply!
Yes you got the jest of it, I really can't say if I speed up or slow down on print strokes have caused me problems, once I'm locked in printing it's all good, but I've been doing this for over twenty years now
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It's been a long time for me since ive printed on a manual, but when I did it, id count the first couple shirts then it was all on feel. my internal clock...LOL
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17x23 is decently big and should work well actually. We have M&R quartz flashes, all 20x24. I remember our earlier smaller IR flashes being problematic with top / bottom or sides flashing and solved it a long time ago with bigger flashes, so thought it was the same issue.
Gotcha. I think I will drop down the flash an inch, to get to 2" away from the pallet. I dont have issues flashing larger prints, so long as the flash is timed well. Thats why I was asking how others count their flash times. I guess nobody in here does that. lol
I'll add that when you are maxing out print area with an IR flash the slightest breeze can cause issue.
As for timing like another poster said it's really just a matter of getting in the groove, it's been a looonnnggg time since I've manually
printed but I don't recall ever counting.
I think over-flashing is a bit of a myth as well, never had washing issues where top colors were coming off from a base.
As long as your dryer is at right temp/dwell you're re-melting everything anyways.
So the counting thing is something I will continue to do. I guess its a bit of an OCD thing for me, but I find comfort in knowing every single print is getting the exact same flash time. I do reduce the flash time as the pallets heat up though, but once we are humming, I want that same flash time for each print. Not counting would def mean dif flash times because I know, when using the stopwatch, some flood and print strokes are faster than others, sometimes by 2 or more seconds.
I suppose the "over flashing" being a myth would help me remove the counting. If that is the case and I wont see colors coming off the base, then who cares if my print stroke was a little longer, so long as it isnt wet when it comes around for the next color. I did have another printer once tell me "who cares if you even cure the base before top colors", but I thought he was crazy because everyone I know and all I have ever heard was to keep it tacky and not over flash. Now im curious to get opinions on over flashing.
Yes you got the jest of it, I really can't say if I speed up or slow down on print strokes have caused me problems, once I'm locked in printing it's all good, but I've been doing this for over twenty years now
Understood. I will say I am surprised to not have any replies saying they do count. As stated in another reply, maybe I am putting too much stock into not "over flashing".
It's been a long time for me since ive printed on a manual, but when I did it, id count the first couple shirts then it was all on feel. my internal clock...LOL
When you did count, it was just out loud, or in your head? Or did you use a timer?
Thank you all for the replies! This thread has me thinking that "over flashing" isn't really a thing, within a reasonable amount of time of course. Im going to search for a thread on that topic, and if one does not exist I will start one. Seems like an interesting topic and could benefit new printers reading.
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Just in my head..
For me there was no set " time" . Different types apparel react differently to the flash. Also when I started I did not have heat in my shop. So it ewas different in the winter than the summer. You do one or 2 shirts of an order and that was it. No overthinking.
And yes one time, one time we had a customer bring back shirts because the top colors washed off the underbase. Someone one we were training did it on their first order. I can not say If it was over flashing, but it happened.
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Just in my head..
For me there was no set " time" . Different types apparel react differently to the flash. Also when I started I did not have heat in my shop. So it ewas different in the winter than the summer. You do one or 2 shirts of an order and that was it. No overthinking.
And yes one time, one time we had a customer bring back shirts because the top colors washed off the underbase. Someone one we were training did it on their first order. I can not say If it was over flashing, but it happened.
Understood. Sounds like I need to just get over the whole "every shirt must have an identical flash time", and just let the pallets spin as I work. Thanks for the input.
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The old Riley Hopkings Swing away flash is the way to go. Some had forced air I believe. You could set time, temp etc. and it would simply swing out of your way and back in. Foot pedals on some, others had a mechanical motion detector. IR at the time so it was always on at the set temp.
Someone probably makes something similar but yes, shell out the dough.
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The old Riley Hopkings Swing away flash is the way to go. Some had forced air I believe. You could set time, temp etc. and it would simply swing out of your way and back in. Foot pedals on some, others had a mechanical motion detector. IR at the time so it was always on at the set temp.
Someone probably makes something similar but yes, shell out the dough.
I saw something like this from vastex. I have a flash that I bought from them in 2004 (or around there) and it still works perfectly!
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Anatol makes a stand alone flash called the Comet, which you can set a timer and it flashes whenever a pallet is under it for whatever time you set
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That would seem to work well and less money than a swing away I'm sure. Quartz I and assuming.
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Anatol makes a stand alone flash called the Comet, which you can set a timer and it flashes whenever a pallet is under it for whatever time you set
That would be a quartz flash then, yeah?
Im not sure how much confidence I have in Anatol anymore. I ordered a jacket hold down from them once and when it arrived it would not open all the way, as the top "lid" part was hitting the pallet arm, stopping it from opening all the way. I couldn't believe how poorly designed it was. So they made a new one with some adjustments and that one also did not work properly. Finally they shrugged their shoulders and said "we dont know why its not working". So I cancelled my order. If they cant even design a jacket hold down to work on their presses, it gives me pause about ordering something as expensive as a quartz flash. I love my Thunder though, even if the powder coating failed in a couple of areas. Dont even get me started on that. Moving forward, I will be purchasing M&R presses only.
BBC makes a motorized swing away accessory for their Black Flashes. It is operated with a foot switch and has a timer to swing away after set time. Maybe Ill look into that. I do want a quartz flash, but a new gas conveyor is the next upgrade, as I am moving into a new studio that is currently under construction. Its a brand new construction and I made sure to have gas hooked up.
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Looks like IR radiant. The flash-amatic would work best (fastest) if the panel was always on however downside is power sucker and heat generator. Never used but ask questions first!
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Anatol makes a stand alone flash called the Comet, which you can set a timer and it flashes whenever a pallet is under it for whatever time you set
That would be a quartz flash then, yeah?
Im not sure how much confidence I have in Anatol anymore. I ordered a jacket hold down from them once and when it arrived it would not open all the way, as the top "lid" part was hitting the pallet arm, stopping it from opening all the way. I couldn't believe how poorly designed it was. So they made a new one with some adjustments and that one also did not work properly. Finally they shrugged their shoulders and said "we dont know why its not working". So I cancelled my order. If they cant even design a jacket hold down to work on their presses, it gives me pause about ordering something as expensive as a quartz flash. I love my Thunder though, even if the powder coating failed in a couple of areas. Dont even get me started on that. Moving forward, I will be purchasing M&R presses only.
BBC makes a motorized swing away accessory for their Black Flashes. It is operated with a foot switch and has a timer to swing away after set time. Maybe Ill look into that. I do want a quartz flash, but a new gas conveyor is the next upgrade, as I am moving into a new studio that is currently under construction. Its a brand new construction and I made sure to have gas hooked up.
Hate to say this but you're going to very disappointed many day's in equipment as all companies have some bad product's here and there, M&R has a great service department for a reason as do a few other's, but I hope you find what you're looking for that will help streamline your production.
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Anatol makes a stand alone flash called the Comet, which you can set a timer and it flashes whenever a pallet is under it for whatever time you set
That would be a quartz flash then, yeah?
Im not sure how much confidence I have in Anatol anymore. I ordered a jacket hold down from them once and when it arrived it would not open all the way, as the top "lid" part was hitting the pallet arm, stopping it from opening all the way. I couldn't believe how poorly designed it was. So they made a new one with some adjustments and that one also did not work properly. Finally they shrugged their shoulders and said "we dont know why its not working". So I cancelled my order. If they cant even design a jacket hold down to work on their presses, it gives me pause about ordering something as expensive as a quartz flash. I love my Thunder though, even if the powder coating failed in a couple of areas. Dont even get me started on that. Moving forward, I will be purchasing M&R presses only.
BBC makes a motorized swing away accessory for their Black Flashes. It is operated with a foot switch and has a timer to swing away after set time. Maybe Ill look into that. I do want a quartz flash, but a new gas conveyor is the next upgrade, as I am moving into a new studio that is currently under construction. Its a brand new construction and I made sure to have gas hooked up.
Hate to say this but you're going to very disappointed many day's in equipment as all companies have some bad product's here and there, M&R has a great service department for a reason as do a few other's, but I hope you find what you're looking for that will help streamline your production.
I understand that, but a jacket hold down isnt astrophysics ya know? How can they possibly not be able to get that right? It really soured me on Anatol. That and their sales guy calls me what feels like every other day.
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I agree with 3 Deep/ Daryl!
Also understand your frustration with things not being what you expect.
In the current industry melt down, the horse that you are cussing, might
Just save your azz in the future. From someone who knows all the brand
From the inside to the out, Anatol is a brand I would consider. If you prefer
M&R, I would look at the M&R Global brand, that is built by a company called
DCC. Made in India, marketed by M&R as of now in the USA. I returned from India 2 weeks ago to give them (DCC) my honest opinion of their equipment As with Anatol
I like the fact that they are privately owned. Not a fan of companies in this industry.
I travel and operate with an open mind. My only stipulation, was that I have full acess
To the machines from the beginning to the end. I want to see anf feel the construction.
I was blown away! I dont have a dog in the fight, but if I did it would be with them.
As far as over cureing ink on flashes, it is called Intercoat adhesion failure. Call your ink co that you use and they will guide you. It is real.it is good, that you have a lot of smart
People on this board that are willing to help and guide you! Dont sweat the small stuff.
Good luck
Winston
904.3430848
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I agree with 3 Deep/ Daryl!
Also understand your frustration with things not being what you expect.
In the current industry melt down, the horse that you are cussing, might
Just save your azz in the future. From someone who knows all the brand
From the inside to the out, Anatol is a brand I would consider. If you prefer
M&R, I would look at the M&R Global brand, that is built by a company called
DCC. Made in India, marketed by M&R as of now in the USA. I returned from India 2 weeks ago to give them (DCC) my honest opinion of their equipment As with Anatol
I like the fact that they are privately owned. Not a fan of companies in this industry.
I travel and operate with an open mind. My only stipulation, was that I have full acess
To the machines from the beginning to the end. I want to see anf feel the construction.
I was blown away! I dont have a dog in the fight, but if I did it would be with them.
As far as over cureing ink on flashes, it is called Intercoat adhesion failure. Call your ink co that you use and they will guide you. It is real.it is good, that you have a lot of smart
People on this board that are willing to help and guide you! Dont sweat the small stuff.
Good luck
Winston
904.3430848
Thank you for the reply! I actually love my Anatol Thunder manual press, well except for the powder coating flaking off without any abrasion against it. Also some of the micros knobs turn like butter and others are stiff. Been that way since it was delivered. Ive got friends who are printers and their Anatol manuals also have the smooth and stiff micros knobs. Guess thats just how it is. That jacket hold down though, seems like it should be pretty easy.
When you say you were blown away, and if you had a dog in the fight, it would be with them, youre referring to Anatol?
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It was in reference to the M&R Global brand manufactured by DCC group in Mumbai, India since you talked about a new equipment decision in the future and you preferred
M&R. I had seen the M&R Global machines a couple of years ago, but did not know much about them. About 9 months ago, I was asked as a favor, if I could install a Copperhead
Charge infrared dryer that had been purchased at last years Print United Show in Las Vegas from one of M&R’s largest dealer, but had been waiting quite a good while for an install. The customer was getting nervous, because it was taking awhile. I said of course I will help you, but why dont your guys install it. The priority was not on the M&R Global
Brand for whatever reason. So I said yes, although a big red flag entered my mind. What was I walking into? He said I would have access to engineers in India should the need arise. The machine had been operating 100% at show. I made plans with their customer
To do the install. I asked for the Manual to see if there was any info/schematics on the machine overnight for next day install. Manual was the best I have seen anywhere! Got the machine in place and put together. Through the process of the build I noticed the quality of the design, thought, construction. Upon install, turned machine on, and no go.
Called contact at M&R and told I needed to talk with someone at M&R to troubleshoot.
Was told no one there was available that new about this machine. Need to talk to India.
2:00 pm my time, 2:00am next day in India. Tech returned a call in 10 min. Some wires
Had been reversed on decomission from show. Go figure! Tech was very polite. I normally wait around for watching machine ti operate and function correctly. Talking with my other partner on install , i asked what is your opinion of dryer. She has sharper eyes than I do.
She was blown away with detail and quality of machine also. It was installed right next to an M&R Fusion dryer. Identical class, similar specs. I was calked contact at M&R and told him all is good.Was asked what I thought about the Global Charge dryer. My response was, no offense, but the should be building your equipment. A nervous laugh, not expecting my response. Quality is top notch. I asked what else they built and was told all kinds that some sold here, but most not. I told him I would like to see all if possible and was asked If I would like to come to see the factory and give an honest opinion. They paid flights, rooms, and the best part! The food. Wow 24-30 hours 12 time zones each way. 3 1/2 days non stop with 3 engineres at my side at all times. I was blown away with the quality of the build, and the pricepoint of machines. They will be at Print United
In Orlando. I would suggest a stop at booth and see for yourself
Nuff said!
Winston
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Off topic but the Copperhead is basically a blue ROQ
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It was in reference to the M&R Global brand manufactured by DCC group in Mumbai, India since you talked about a new equipment decision in the future and you preferred
M&R. I had seen the M&R Global machines a couple of years ago, but did not know much about them. About 9 months ago, I was asked as a favor, if I could install a Copperhead
Charge infrared dryer that had been purchased at last years Print United Show in Las Vegas from one of M&R’s largest dealer, but had been waiting quite a good while for an install. The customer was getting nervous, because it was taking awhile. I said of course I will help you, but why dont your guys install it. The priority was not on the M&R Global
Brand for whatever reason. So I said yes, although a big red flag entered my mind. What was I walking into? He said I would have access to engineers in India should the need arise. The machine had been operating 100% at show. I made plans with their customer
To do the install. I asked for the Manual to see if there was any info/schematics on the machine overnight for next day install. Manual was the best I have seen anywhere! Got the machine in place and put together. Through the process of the build I noticed the quality of the design, thought, construction. Upon install, turned machine on, and no go.
Called contact at M&R and told I needed to talk with someone at M&R to troubleshoot.
Was told no one there was available that new about this machine. Need to talk to India.
2:00 pm my time, 2:00am next day in India. Tech returned a call in 10 min. Some wires
Had been reversed on decomission from show. Go figure! Tech was very polite. I normally wait around for watching machine ti operate and function correctly. Talking with my other partner on install , i asked what is your opinion of dryer. She has sharper eyes than I do.
She was blown away with detail and quality of machine also. It was installed right next to an M&R Fusion dryer. Identical class, similar specs. I was calked contact at M&R and told him all is good.Was asked what I thought about the Global Charge dryer. My response was, no offense, but the should be building your equipment. A nervous laugh, not expecting my response. Quality is top notch. I asked what else they built and was told all kinds that some sold here, but most not. I told him I would like to see all if possible and was asked If I would like to come to see the factory and give an honest opinion. They paid flights, rooms, and the best part! The food. Wow 24-30 hours 12 time zones each way. 3 1/2 days non stop with 3 engineres at my side at all times. I was blown away with the quality of the build, and the pricepoint of machines. They will be at Print United
In Orlando. I would suggest a stop at booth and see for yourself
Nuff said!
Winston
Thanks for all the info! Yeah just from talking with other printers who have used tons of different machine brands/types, most tend to say that M&R should be the highest quality option. I suppose that would explain their top pricing too! lol
So say I do migrate to M&R, how do I ensure the machines I buy are built in the better factory in India? From the sounds of it, its just specific items made there, and others are made in the US?
About the food in India, you are a lucky man! Indian cuisine is by far my favorite. Lamb Vindaloo is my go-to dish accompanied by some of those Samosas! That stuff is soooooo good. The complexity in those flavors is unmatched by anything else I have ever had. That flavor depth is unreal. Now I need to go to India!
Off topic but the Copperhead is basically a blue ROQ
Interesting. Thanks for the info.