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screen printing => Equipment => Topic started by: asecominc on March 28, 2012, 08:39:48 AM
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So I'm looking to go gas in the next 6-10 months, but not sure what to consider when buying (Features, BTU, new vs. old technology, etc.). Going used is the preferred method for me, but I'm always open to new if the pros outweigh the cons. I've come across some used older gas dryers, but it's difficult for me to know what the older models (pre-2000) do versus the newer ones. Also not sure of extra costs like installation of exhaust and hookup to gas line. All I know is that we're about done using electric and would like to get a decent gas dryer. Any sort of direction would be greatly appreciated.
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I don't know when the switch to higher efficiency gas dryers was made, but you need to get one that uses around 150,000-180,000 BTU's while running. Most of them will use around 250,000+ while warming up(depending on size). Once a dryer is warm, they use a lot less.
The 2 dryers that are good bets are the M&R Sprint and the Interchange MD-8 (which is what I run).
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Check out Alan's review of his new dryer. Not trying to be a mouth piece but what he's got sure is making sense for him!
http://www.theshirtboard.com/index.php/topic,2547.0.html (http://www.theshirtboard.com/index.php/topic,2547.0.html)
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Give Winston Strickland a call. He is the dryer guru. 904-343-0848
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that thing is a beast...no doubt. I don't know what the cost was to be honest, but it looks like a heavier duty version of the dryer I have. Interchange makes an airjet that is beefier, it was overkill for us.
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I think you're doing the right thing by getting away from electric, I'd advise anyone to do the same if there is any way to get gas ran to your shop. Our new dryer is saving us around $700, give or take, a month on electricity/gas bills. I think the argument for new versus old technology is very interesting when it comes to dryers, because it's function is much more simple than the argument about autos. I looked for production capacity, efficiency, features and service during and after the sale and we went with the Sprint International from M&R. I do think that Interchange makes a good dryer, I got to see an MD-8 last month right after install and I tried my best not to compare it to ours because they are two completely different ranges of dryer, and I did appreciate the simplicity and function of the dryer. I'd like to see a more comparable Interchange like the Airjet one of these days to really get a feel of how it measures up to the Sprint International.
I spent a few hours with Rich and he walked me through our dryer and showed me all the advancements that have been made with the dryers over the years and it was very enlightening. They look like a giant heat box, but there is a lot more to it than that.
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The same here, asecominc. Looking for a 60" belt and 12' heat chamber to run two autos with it. Sprint International for sure looks like a great piece and we are using a bunch of M&R stuff already, but we were quoted over 52,000$ +18% VAT for International 60/12 and we decided it is too much. Now we are considering offers from Adelco and German Tesoma and we will also contact UK/Holland based Green Burn/ Calmatech. The right now we are contacting some of the owners of these dryers we know, regarding gas consumption.. For dryer of this size it should be something in 150,000 BTU range during average runs. We will run it on propane (something like 90,000 BTU in one gallon, if I'm right) and we are based in Europe.
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Thanks for all the quick replies. The old v. new tech is something I'm strongly considering as a factor. I guess I'm so naive about gas dryers that I feel I need to be informed as well about the advancements in tech. This has definitely helped me find some sense of where I should start and prioritize when looking for a gas dryer. I currently have a 24"x12' electric dryer handling 1 6/8 auto and 2 6/4 manuals. Do you guys think going to a Sprint 48" would be overboard? Just make the jump to a Mini-Sprint? I'm looking towards the future and hope to have another auto in the next 12-18 months.
Again, thank you for the replies....they are very helpful!
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Thanks for all the quick replies. The old v. new tech is something I'm strongly considering as a factor. I guess I'm so naive about gas dryers that I feel I need to be informed as well about the advancements in tech. This has definitely helped me find some sense of where I should start and prioritize when looking for a gas dryer. I currently have a 24"x12' electric dryer handling 1 6/8 auto and 2 6/4 manuals. Do you guys think going to a Sprint 48" would be overboard? Just make the jump to a Mini-Sprint? I'm looking towards the future and hope to have another auto in the next 12-18 months.
Again, thank you for the replies....they are very helpful!
Mini Sprint with 38" belt is not a smart choice to handle two autos. Even with 48" belt you may sometimes face problems if the prints on both presses are large or waterbased/discharge. New gas dryer is not a cheap investment, it is something you buy once in maybe 10 years and if you are planning another auto in the near future, I would take 60" belt. Can you imagine frustration with buying new expensive gas dryer just to realize that belt is not wide enough for your needs? As for those manuals, I think you wont need that dryer with 12' heat chamber. Smart choice would be one gas dryer for 1-2 autos and maybe something like Economax for manual. That little fella maybe looks like a toy, but I can tell you: few years ago we used to run 300 pcs/hour with Chameleon and Economax. Today we are using manual only for samples or some very short runs and Economax is still there. It is 6 years old, not a single major issue, with minor electricity consumption. Used one should be in 2,500$ range.
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i have a 48" belt, I should have gone 60" or 36." 48 is right between useful for 2 presses and running 1 press(which we do most of the time.)
our shop is a little narrow for a 60" belt, I figured I would go narrow to fit a bigger press in at a later date.
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The same here, asecominc. Looking for a 60" belt and 12' heat chamber to run two autos with it. Sprint International for sure looks like a great piece and we are using a bunch of M&R stuff already, but we were quoted over 52,000$ +18% VAT for International 60/12 and we decided it is too much. Now we are considering offers from Adelco and German Tesoma and we will also contact UK/Holland based Green Burn/ Calmatech. The right now we are contacting some of the owners of these dryers we know, regarding gas consumption.. For dryer of this size it should be something in 150,000 BTU range during average runs. We will run it on propane (something like 90,000 BTU in one gallon, if I'm right) and we are based in Europe.
M&R make quite a few dryers that are way lower in price than the dryer you ask for a quote for. The Sprint International H.O. (high output) is way too much dryer for the shop you have posted on the site. You should be looking at the Sprint 2000 which is rated at over 2000 units per hour on plastisol and 1600 per hour on water-base. These numbers are for typical prints. I cannot state with 100% certainty as I do not know the substrates nor the ink used. That dryer will consume roughly 180,000 BTU per hour with a running cost of less than $2.00 U.S. dollars per hour here. The list price on that dryer is $35,650 U.S. Just a fyi.
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2 bucks a hour. wow thats technology. rich, whats the cost savings running 8 hours a day with that unit vs. a older ray paul 500,000 btu as a comparison? or even a older sprint ? thanks
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I can't be exact but at least around half the cost.
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@ Rich since we're talking about coast what would be the cost on running my old Economax per hour which you know is all electric.
Darryl
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Pm me a serial # and a copy of your electric bill and I will tell you.
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Ok will do Rich
Darryl
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Those numbers quoted above represent which size of the Sprint 2000 series? 48/60/72?
The same here, asecominc. Looking for a 60" belt and 12' heat chamber to run two autos with it. Sprint International for sure looks like a great piece and we are using a bunch of M&R stuff already, but we were quoted over 52,000$ +18% VAT for International 60/12 and we decided it is too much. Now we are considering offers from Adelco and German Tesoma and we will also contact UK/Holland based Green Burn/ Calmatech. The right now we are contacting some of the owners of these dryers we know, regarding gas consumption.. For dryer of this size it should be something in 150,000 BTU range during average runs. We will run it on propane (something like 90,000 BTU in one gallon, if I'm right) and we are based in Europe.
M&R make quite a few dryers that are way lower in price than the dryer you ask for a quote for. The Sprint International H.O. (high output) is way too much dryer for the shop you have posted on the site. You should be looking at the Sprint 2000 which is rated at over 2000 units per hour on plastisol and 1600 per hour on water-base. These numbers are for typical prints. I cannot state with 100% certainty as I do not know the substrates nor the ink used. That dryer will consume roughly 180,000 BTU per hour with a running cost of less than $2.00 U.S. dollars per hour here. The list price on that dryer is $35,650 U.S. Just a fyi.
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Those numbers quoted above represent which size of the Sprint 2000 series? 48/60/72?The same here, asecominc. Looking for a 60" belt and 12' heat chamber to run two autos with it. Sprint International for sure looks like a great piece and we are using a bunch of M&R stuff already, but we were quoted over 52,000$ +18% VAT for International 60/12 and we decided it is too much. Now we are considering offers from Adelco and German Tesoma and we will also contact UK/Holland based Green Burn/ Calmatech. The right now we are contacting some of the owners of these dryers we know, regarding gas consumption.. For dryer of this size it should be something in 150,000 BTU range during average runs. We will run it on propane (something like 90,000 BTU in one gallon, if I'm right) and we are based in Europe.
M&R make quite a few dryers that are way lower in price than the dryer you ask for a quote for. The Sprint International H.O. (high output) is way too much dryer for the shop you have posted on the site. You should be looking at the Sprint 2000 which is rated at over 2000 units per hour on plastisol and per hour on water-base. These numbers are for typical prints. I cannot state with 100% certainty as I do not know the substrates nor the ink used. That dryer will consume roughly 180,000 BTU per hour with a running cost of less than $2.00 U.S. dollars per hour here. The list price on that dryer is $35,650 U.S. Just a fyi.
The units and consumption stated was for a 60"/12' of heat chamber dryer. The Sprint 2000 and Sprint International consume and produce the same amounts.
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M&R make quite a few dryers that are way lower in price than the dryer you ask for a quote for. The Sprint International H.O. (high output) is way too much dryer for the shop you have posted on the site. You should be looking at the Sprint 2000 which is rated at over 2000 units per hour on plastisol and 1600 per hour on water-base. These numbers are for typical prints. I cannot state with 100% certainty as I do not know the substrates nor the ink used. That dryer will consume roughly 180,000 BTU per hour with a running cost of less than $2.00 U.S. dollars per hour here. The list price on that dryer is $35,650 U.S. Just a fyi.
Thanks for the advice, Rich. Something like Sprint 2000 is probably what I need. I saw new installed Mini Sprint recently and man, what a great dryer that is. But from one of your earlier messages I understood that list prices of all M&R equipment should be the same in every country. And if I got it right, only costs of the freight, customs, duties, taxes should be added. However, what I have here is Sprint 2000 60/12 quoted at $47,000 (+18% VAT). Knowing that customs rates/ duties are in 1% range here for that type of goods, the rest of $10,000 looks a way too high for the shipping/install cost? Also, from your experience, is Radicure 60/10 capable of dealing with water based and discharge prints coming from two autos. I'm asking that 'cause here in Serbia we have pretty unusual situation regarding gas/electricity prices. We have one of the highest prices of gasoline, diesel, propane (over 100% higher than US and Turkey, f.e) and the lowest electricity price in Europe, so according to my calculations big electric dryer may be a better choice. What would be average consumption for that big (60/10) Radicure anyway? Something like 25 kw/h?
Thanks
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Is there a huge difference regarding functionality and efficiency between a pre-2000 Sprint and the newer Sprint 2000s? Like does the current technology greatly outweigh that of an older model?
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I can't be exact but at least around half the cost.
THANKS
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Is there a huge difference regarding functionality and efficiency between a pre-2000 Sprint and the newer Sprint 2000s? Like does the current technology greatly outweigh that of an older model?
The dryer labeled Sprint 2000 was a drastic change in consumption and emmitting heat into your shop. The Sprint 2000 series is twice as good as the Sprint was! Burns at least 1/3 less gas and skin temperature is cool to the touch while curing at least 25% more garments.
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M&R make quite a few dryers that are way lower in price than the dryer you ask for a quote for. The Sprint International H.O. (high output) is way too much dryer for the shop you have posted on the site. You should be looking at the Sprint 2000 which is rated at over 2000 units per hour on plastisol and 1600 per hour on water-base. These numbers are for typical prints. I cannot state with 100% certainty as I do not know the substrates nor the ink used. That dryer will consume roughly 180,000 BTU per hour with a running cost of less than $2.00 U.S. dollars per hour here. The list price on that dryer is $35,650 U.S. Just a fyi.
Thanks for the advice, Rich. Something like Sprint 2000 is probably what I need. I saw new installed Mini Sprint recently and man, what a great dryer that is. But from one of your earlier messages I understood that list prices of all M&R equipment should be the same in every country. And if I got it right, only costs of the freight, customs, duties, taxes should be added. However, what I have here is Sprint 2000 60/12 quoted at $47,000 (+18% VAT). Knowing that customs rates/ duties are in 1% range here for that type of goods, the rest of $10,000 looks a way too high for the shipping/install cost? Also, from your experience, is Radicure 60/10 capable of dealing with water based and discharge prints coming from two autos. I'm asking that 'cause here in Serbia we have pretty unusual situation regarding gas/electricity prices. We have one of the highest prices of gasoline, diesel, propane (over 100% higher than US and Turkey, f.e) and the lowest electricity price in Europe, so according to my calculations big electric dryer may be a better choice. What would be average consumption for that big (60/10) Radicure anyway? Something like 25 kw/h?
Thanks
There is another option as well. in some areas customers cannot get gas but need the air flow of the Sprint 2000. That dryer is called a Sprint 2000E. Below you will find the KW specs for it as well as the Radicure. The Radicure would slow the presses down to handle the discharge. Not the best choice for water. It will do it but slow!
Radicure D
• 208/230 V, 3 ph, 112/123 A, 50/60 Hz, 38.8 kW
• 380/415 V, 3 ph, 67 A, 50/60 38.8 kW
Sprint 2000E
• 380V, 3 ph 100A, 50Hz, 65kW
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Hey Rich,
Do you have any rough numbers for what the Radicure can do per hour on water based/discharge? Preferably on the smaller sized one, 6 foot chamber, 3 or 4 panels.
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Hey Rich,
Do you have any rough numbers for what the Radicure can do per hour on water based/discharge? Preferably on the smaller sized one, 6 foot chamber, 3 or 4 panels.
Rough guess would be 200 with 3panels and 250 with 4th panel. This is just a guess.
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Hey Rich,
Do you have any rough numbers for what the Radicure can do per hour on water based/discharge? Preferably on the smaller sized one, 6 foot chamber, 3 or 4 panels.
We have Radicure 36" belt, 6' chamber/3 panels. I can confirm what Rich wrote, It can handle 200/h, normal print size.Temperature at 500, belt speed 1.8. With small amount of some fixator additive/ catalysator added in the ink you can speed up the belt and make 250 without problem.
That's one great and well built dryer, btw. We have it for six years now and have only one single issue with exaust blower. Excellent insulation (read: less energy consumption and less heat into working enviroment), high quality heat panels, electrics, etc...