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screen printing => General Screen Printing => Topic started by: jesterapparel on April 03, 2012, 10:50:54 AM
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They made a movie about him
Confidence Man Trailer #1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLqA2W0I51E#ws)
Anyone remember this. I new was to good to be true and stayed away.
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You may or may not remember posts I made about these clowns and the scheme that people bought into.
To this day I hold some of the old forum members who participated as partly responsible for the fraud because that's exactly how ponzis and pyramids work.
Remember, if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
For those who are unfamiliar with this scam, it involved shirts at substantial discounts, but with a significant lag in delivery time. Many bought just a few hundred and then posted how it worked just fine. The more folks who bought in and actually got product, the more folks were intrigued and trusting, until they made a really large purchase and were left holding the bag.
The same people used to post on a financial investing forum with another scheme that promised to double one's money so fast that a mere $10,000 would become $1,000,000 in less than a year. Even during the booming Clinton years, that just wasn't going to happen.
Now, some would have called my warnings "Cyber Bullying" lol!
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You may or may not remember posts I made about these clowns and the scheme that people bought into.
To this day I hold some of the old forum members who participated as partly responsible for the fraud because that's exactly how ponzis and pyramids work.
Remember, if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
For those who are unfamiliar with this scam, it involved shirts at substantial discounts, but with a significant lag in delivery time. Many bought just a few hundred and then posted how it worked just fine. The more folks who bought in and actually got product, the more folks were intrigued and trusting, until they made a really large purchase and were left holding the bag.
The same people used to post on a financial investing forum with another scheme that promised to double one's money so fast that a mere $10,000 would become $1,000,000 in less than a year. Even during the booming Clinton years, that just wasn't going to happen.
Now, some would have called my warnings "Cyber Bullying" lol!
Ya, this was during my infant years in the industry and even I new to stay far away from it. Their prices were to unbelievable and you new something had to be up. I like how he makes a movie about it and makes himself look like a victim. I remember people saying my shirts showed up but they arrived in Broder Boxes.
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On a long an distant board, I posted this on 10/02/06 -
I have been truly fascinated reading all the posts related to this and it sure does sound too good to be true.
I just have a small problem fronting large sums of money to someone who is, what appears to be, a one-man operation, with a PO Box for an address in a town of 2.2 miles by 2.2 miles, with a population of 388 people in 111 families, who is only reachable by PO Box, phone (probably cell) and/or email.
Hopefully, down the road, I will be laughed at, ridiculed, and just generally called silly, but right now all I can think about is Doyle Lonnegan. If you need help with that, here's the link -
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0070735/ (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0070735/)
And then on 02/16/08, my post was -
You could kneel down and count your blessings that you did not order from them, especially near the end.
I remember posting my (negative) opinion as to what I thought of the operation. Internet searches could only find a P.O. Box address in a small town amd the only contact being a phone number, probably just a cell phone. Buyers had to pay the entire payment up front and wait 4-6 weeks or more to receive the products.
Looked to me like something I would expect to see Paul Newman and Robert Redford in (Sting) and I said so.
As I remember, I took a little heat for my comment from some of the so-called buyers. Now I can always believe that maybe my comment saved someone from a significant financial loss.
When something looks too good to be true....it usually is.
It just had that "smell" to it.
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Ya, this was during my infant years in the industry and even I new to stay far away from it. There prices were to unbelievable and you new something had to be up. I like how he makes a movie about it and makes himself look like a victim. I remember people saying my shirts showed up but the arrived in Broder Boxes.
I'm sure that it was run as a Ponzi, in which he bought shirts with "client" money, and delivered (at a loss) to establish a reputation. Folks first stuck their toes in to check the temperature, but as reports of "delivered as promised" came in, many started diving head first.
I found it disheartening that besides the investment scam I mentioned, he also picked this industry as especially gullible (and greedy) for another.
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Ya, this was during my infant years in the industry and even I new to stay far away from it. There prices were to unbelievable and you new something had to be up. I like how he makes a movie about it and makes himself look like a victim. I remember people saying my shirts showed up but the arrived in Broder Boxes.
I'm sure that it was run as a Ponzi, in which he bought shirts with "client" money, and delivered (at a loss) to establish a reputation. Folks first stuck their toes in to check the temperature, but as reports of "delivered as promised" came in, many started diving head first.
I found it disheartening that besides the investment scam I mentioned, he also picked this industry as especially gullible (and greedy) for another.
He also took investments in the company and promised outrages returns on their money. So he was doing a ponzi on both sides of the business.
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people are stupid, both for attempting a ponzi scheme, and participating in one that is so blatantly obvious. If it was that easy to sell shirts for that price, the distros would be using his method as well.
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For context, here is his first "come-on" in Product Promotions from TSPMB from early 2006
For those with burning curiosity, a search over there on this particular subject is unusually fruitful and accurate.
Hi there. My name is Hugh and my company is Cheap Shirts For Bands. As you can imagine we have a pretty focused clientele. We offer great prices to our customers and starting realizing that most people wanted certain garments, namely black and white t-shirts. Some were fine with the FOL 50/50 or 100% and some needed the heavier duty Hanes Beefy T. We were able to buy these from a certain place in bulk and thus lowered our costs significantly. Then we decided to offer blank goods as an opportunity to other screenprinters and still make a profit. Currently we offer the Fruit of the Loom 50/50 and 100% at $.60 for white Small through X-Large and just $.20 more for black. Also we have the Beefy T starting at $.90. We also offer free shipping. There are no minimums either. The only drawback is the turnaround time which is a little over 60 days. This allows us to order everything at once and reduce the costs. It's a great way to compete with the huge companies who can afford to buy and house 100,000 shirts and reduce they're prices. We may add some other garments in the future. We have a store currently set up and are in the process of getting the domain forwarded to the lenghthy address but for now here it is: http://estores.merchantpartners.com/wplbz/index.php (http://estores.merchantpartners.com/wplbz/index.php) We are located in Southern Illinois. If anyone is interested in buying some shirts from us, feel free to check it out. You can also email admin@printvest.com or sales@cheapshirtsforbands. Thanks everybody and good luck.
Good luck is right! lol!
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"Able to buy these from a certain place"
Sure thing pal.
I followed his activity on a forum for HYIP. (high yield investment programs, I had no idea
either)
It was totally bizarre. People would perform their due diligence, express their worries, but still
invest. For some the promise of easy money is just too much to ignore.
Lastly, his choice of industry was a result of his being in a band, purchasing printed shirts,
then starting a printing company of his own, and apparently failing at that.
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The sad thing the printvest side was only a small part of the scheme used to bring in much needed cash to keep his other much larger scheme going. He was running a ponzi scheme called hippylove that well if anyone researches the net can see has crashed.
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Wow. As you guys know it can be done with screen printing equipment as well....... :o
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Sad thing is their band wasn't that bad if they'd stuck to that he wouldn't be in the shower with a hundred other men....
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I think that some folks have a different itch to scratch, and it's not going to be satisfied by working honestly, even if that "work" is creative, and even if it makes for a reasonable living.
This type feels a need to lie, trick, and deceive, and misrepresent to feel superior. In fact, it's not even just "feeling" superior as much as demonstrating their brand of superiority to us mere mortals.
These folks do it with glee.
Beware the smirk...
Smiling Faces Undisputed Truth (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sV69WBvFGBA#)
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When something looks too good to be true....it usually is. [/b]It just had that "smell" to it.
Indeed. Kind of reminds me of those barter schemes that popped up in the 90's. Blanks were "traded" and screen printing "credits" were utilized among participants. There were no winners in that rainmaker brain fart as well.
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Hello All,
Greetings from a ghost from the past. I've been out of prison for over a year but on probation for another 2 years or so. I came to say a few things. I am really sorry about the mess that I made in the whole Printvest debacle. Take it as you like, but I truly thought I was going to change the way busy was done and make life better for a great many. In the middle of this statement I also want to clarify a misconception. All screenprinters and embroiderers either received their shirts or got their money back. They all paid with credit cards and were in a position to do chargebacks. None were disputed. I received a cashiers check from a gentlemen from Iowa that got cancelled, then a partial reimbursement from him afterward, otherwise it was all credit cards. (Sorry you had some conversations Jeff, I told them you were only a customer and I hope they left you alone.)
It might seem like splitting hairs but when an individual or company buys a tangible product, they expect to receive it or else get refunded and that is exactly what happened with regard to t-shirt buyers. I want it to be well understand that t-shirt printers did not get left short. The participants in the high yield investment program did however. These are the folks that I send a US Postal Service money order to every month, or at least I hope it gets sent to them from the Circuit Clerk in my district every month. I will likely be filling those out for the rest of my life. I work a fairly menial job and a healthy chunk of that goes to restitution each month. It is a constant and steady reminder of poor decisions. As was living in a dark and cold place for a few years, surrounded by strange and scary individuals.
Prison was not overly enjoyable but I like to think I made the best of it. I grew up fairly poor but went to public school in the rural Midwest and had fine parents. I can say that the majority of people that I met in prison came from worse places and had fewer opportunities, much to my shame. I spent a lot of time in the prison library working on a novel that I hope to publish soon. I spent so much of my time typing that other inmates thought I was a lawyer and came to me with many legal questions. Even after I explained that I had no legal background, I wound up typing lots of letters for them, personal and to lawyers on the outside on their behalf. I was always offered compensation in goods from the commissary but I declined and as a result, I was looked out for by some powerful individuals on the inside. Time well spent indeed.
I was able to spend many nights thinking about my actions and wondering about the number of people I affected. It is often only in such situations where the daily hustle bustle and grind have come to a screeching halt that we can comprehend our place in the world and how it leads us to where we are in the moment. Many in this life do not get such an opportunity to find out what truly matters and that every moment we have in this life is to be utilized to the best possible effect. I try not to lose that sensation.
I stumbled upon this thread over a year ago, and my instincts told me to leave well enough alone. I probably should do the same a year later but I feel compelled for some sense of something close to closure. It would seem appropriate to exist as something of a warning to others or a lesson to be learned perhaps for some enterprising soul who thinks they are smarter than they really are or who is willing to risk everything for some unknown result. As well, for those I directly affected, I want it to be known that I faced sincere consequences for my actions. A clown did not wander his way into your life and livelihood and cause a mess only to disappear into the sunset without any level of resolution. I did what I did and faced some frightening repercussions, both from federal authorities and in the midst of hardcore criminals who became my living companions. From an honor roll student, Boy Scout, who only had a couple of small town speeding tickets, I can say it was quite an intense experience.
What I really want to say is that I am sorry to you all for what I did. I didn’t want it to turn out so poorly but I really should have known better. I hope your businesses are successful and you make your customers very happy with what you create for them. This world really is a wonderful place and it is worth putting effort in to make it better each day. I wish you all the best that it has to offer. If anyone has any questions, feel free to post them here or email me at printvest@gmail.com. Perhaps to save some effort here are some FAQs:
1. Was I raped in prison?
No
2. Was I stabbed or beaten?
No
3. Can I still sell you dirt cheap shirts?
HELL no! :)
Sincerely,
Hugh DeNeal
Printvest
Hyippylove
P.S.
The movie was alright, certainly a strange feeling to watch, almost like the life review we might expect when we die. Quite a world we live in!
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Very odd post from you Hugh. In the beginning you still claim your belief that the scheme was viable but further in you seem to take some responsibility. What I do not get is how you think there was any possibility your business plan could be possible and legit?
It's simple anyone here can ask any one of their vendors or even the mills directly what the lowest possible price you can get any brandof t shirt. No matter your buying power what is the cheapest? Well your .60 falls far short of reality. Any vendor will tell you the margins in t shirts is literally pennies, not dimes as you imply. It's the same for the mills, their margins are in the pennies far from your claims that shirts can be bought for as much or more than half normal whole sale pricing.
Your whole post lacks any real acceptance of guilt. No where do you state you were running a classic Ponzi scheme and in my opinion no man is no better than what he originally was till he takes full responsibility. Just because as you state t shirt buyers were all reimbursed doesnt mean much, you admit most were CC and had charges reversed I would assume others were reimbursed be caused you were forced to do so by the authorities.
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Inkman, I apologize if my post sounds like I am not taking full responsibility, but I certainly do. There is no one to blame but myself for what I did 7 years ago and pled guilty which I most definitely was. As well, I carry a great amount of guilt for being so foolish and causing great damage. I really have no purpose in coming here, and it is probably not advisable but I do feel compelled to say I am sorry. The sentiment may be trite, but I can say with all honesty that I did not set out to commit a crime. But that is what happened and I did become a criminal, through no fault but my own. The judge banged the gavel and I was sentenced to prison and I served my time without complaint. It is my sincere wish that everyone has the best of success in business as well as life.
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Inkman, I apologize if my post sounds like I am not taking full responsibility, but I certainly do. There is no one to blame but myself for what I did 7 years ago and pled guilty which I most definitely was. As well, I carry a great amount of guilt for being so foolish and causing great damage. I really have no purpose in coming here, and it is probably not advisable but I do feel compelled to say I am sorry. The sentiment may be trite, but I can say with all honesty that I did not set out to commit a crime. But that is what happened and I did become a criminal, through no fault but my own. The judge banged the gavel and I was sentenced to prison and I served my time without complaint. It is my sincere wish that everyone has the best of success in business as well as life.
Is there a place online we can watch the Movie?
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To my knowledge the film is not yet available online for download or streaming. There is a website www.indigogoatproductions.com (http://www.indigogoatproductions.com) where it can be purchased. It was featured in a couple of film festivals but I don't believe the sales of been very heavy. It was done while I was in Leavenworth and pretty well complete by the time I got out. The reviews were fairly mixed. My own opinion of it is nearly irrelevant though some parts I was impressed technically and there were scenes that I was underwhelmed. Personally the most cringe inducing moments of the film are me babbling on about the whole mess. Those interviews were filmed about 10 days before I went away. It is a very surreal feeling. I've watched it in its entirety only once and that was enough for me.
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Leavenworth is a notorious prison, is it a hardcore max through and through or was there lower level areas for white collar non violent folks? Here in CT a supermax is a supermax, a medium level is a medium level, no prison is a mix.
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In 2005 it dropped security level to a medium and I was in there for only a few days. They say it is for processing and such, but it is more of a means to intimidate. I did most all of my time in minimum security. It could have been much worse I know. I was able to walk every day on the inside of the fence, at least for a little while. Near the end of my release I was transferred closer to home and lived in a halfway house with folks of all security levels. I avoided trouble with everyone though even with a few close calls. Very happy to be away from all of that I must say. Lesson learned, without question.