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screen printing => Equipment => Topic started by: Mark @ Hurricane Printing on August 08, 2012, 02:33:43 PM
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I am looking to buy some 23x31 panel frames. I believe my buddy uses the Lawson one's and he has the tool to attach the mesh panels. Are there any other companies you would suggest to try out? I'm looking around on the net and all I really see are the Lawson ones. I will most probably go with those unless someone has a suggestion.
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what sort of panel frames are you talking about? there is a brand called Panel Frame.
If you are looking for higher tension, I would check out Shur-loc frames or their panels in retentionable frames.
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I am looking to buy some 23x31 panel frames. I believe my buddy uses the Lawson one's and he has the tool to attach the mesh panels. Are there any other companies you would suggest to try out? I'm looking around on the net and all I really see are the Lawson ones. I will most probably go with those unless someone has a suggestion.
surloc makes EZ Frames. We use them, they are very nice!
pierre
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I use smaller ones from Shurloc and love it. Much nicer to print, coat, reclaim, everything is better since I switched from statics.
Some people say that Newman panels are better, but Shurloc panels with Newman frames is very good combination.
Look to get some used frames, clean them up and you will be good to go (or new ones if you have money).
Good luck
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If your talking the Rebranded Panel Frames now called green screens or Trax or something or another don't frigging bother. I bought a crap load of the frame systems a couple years ago when it was new and still called Panel Frames, the other day I ordered a box of 160's from Nazdar and the frigging six pack was over $100! They are ok but not worth any where near that amount.
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If your talking the Rebranded Panel Frames now called green screens or Trax or something or another don't frigging bother. I bought a crap load of the frame systems a couple years ago when it was new and still called Panel Frames, the other day I ordered a box of 160's from Nazdar and the frigging six pack was over $100! They are ok but not worth any where near that amount.
Mike: Please let me look into this tomorrow because something doesn’t sound right.
I thought that a box of (6) 156T mesh panels were less than $80.00 or about $13 each.
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That's still pretty darn cheap at 16.67 per panel.
The 150/48 panels we got from Shur-loc ran 29.30 per {!} when ordering around 36 panels at a time. Special size though, 25x30.
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I think shur-locs with newmans is the way to go...their econ mesh rocks as well...we just got another 20 newmans and have already stretched 6 of them today and all were right at 40 newtons....also for our DTS it works simple with no sagging corners and we do not have to tape them....
sam
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If your talking the Rebranded Panel Frames now called green screens or Trax or something or another don't frigging bother. I bought a crap load of the frame systems a couple years ago when it was new and still called Panel Frames, the other day I ordered a box of 160's from Nazdar and the frigging six pack was over $100! They are ok but not worth any where near that amount.
Mike: Please let me look into this tomorrow because something doesn’t sound right.
I thought that a box of (6) 156T mesh panels were less than $80.00 or about $13 each.
Just checked our invoice we were charged $100.81 for a box of 156Y 23x31
Now I checked the web listing and they are listed for $77.80?
Whats up with that?
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If your talking the Rebranded Panel Frames now called green screens or Trax or something or another don't frigging bother. I bought a crap load of the frame systems a couple years ago when it was new and still called Panel Frames, the other day I ordered a box of 160's from Nazdar and the frigging six pack was over $100! They are ok but not worth any where near that amount.
Mike: Please let me look into this tomorrow because something doesn’t sound right.
I thought that a box of (6) 156T mesh panels were less than $80.00 or about $13 each.
Just checked our invoice we were charged $100.81 for a box of 156Y 23x31
Now I checked the web listing and they are listed for $77.80?
Whats up with that?
Mike: What’s up with that is that I think that we possibly shipped you the wrong item, or if we shipped the correct items then we billed you for the wrong item. You are 100% correct that the price for (6) of the Item Number MSB15664W – 23”x31” 156T White Sefar Trax Screen Mesh panels is $77.80, and if that is what you ordered then that is what you should have paid. We also have Item Number RFSA15664W – 32”x31” 156T Sefar Roller Screen Mesh Panels in our system that are priced at $100.80 for a box of (6).
I have alerted David Heald - Inside Sales Specialist at our Pennsauken, NJ office with your concerns and asked him to follow-up with you directly to sort things out. Could you please do me a favor and drop Dave an email at dheald@nazdar.com (with a cc; to me pwalsh@nazdar.com) with the best phone number or other method to contact you. Please accept my apologies on behalf of Nazdar SourceOne for the mix-up in pricing and you can be sure that we will make things right.
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There is the problem Peter I ordered something I always have ordered and that is sefar mesh panels 156. I never heard of the panels also being roller mesh thats news to me and no one told me when I was ordering so they sent me the roller mesh ones.
I am using the basic panel frames not rollers. Roller mesh would have no advantage for me since I cant retension them or bring them up to the high tensions roller mesh allows.
Guess its my bad since I never knew they even existed.
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There is the problem Peter I ordered something I always have ordered and that is sefar mesh panels 156. I never heard of the panels also being roller mesh thats news to me and no one told me when I was ordering so they sent me the roller mesh ones.
I am using the basic panel frames not rollers. Roller mesh would have no advantage for me since I cant retension them or bring them up to the high tensions roller mesh allows.
Guess its my bad since I never knew they even existed.
Mike, there’s nothing that you could have done differently. it’s 100% our fault that someone looked up the incorrect item causing you to be shipped and billed for the wrong products.
All I can tell you is that we strive to be perfect on each and every order, and on those few occasions where we get it wrong (as we did here) we do all that we can to make it right.
Sorry for the confusion.
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Not your guys fault Peter like i said its more confusion on my end. Up until recently the only Panel frames that existed was one style only, some where along the line these new panels came out and I simply didn,t know it. I was just shocked at the price and figured Shurlok was increasing the price structure since they took over. And to be honest the system is nice but not great so that price would have scared me away from using these panels. Now i know to be careful when ordering these in the future at the normal price point.
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Heck, I'm just glad that the panels are available again as for a while, the product was in limbo.
I still think that it is a viable "tweener" product.
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Heck, I'm just glad that the panels are available again as for a while, the product was in limbo.
I still think that it is a viable "tweener" product.
I also think that if you are charging screen charges and eliminating the reclaim process it could be a huge labor savings. Just toss the panel when done.
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Mike, Sefar makes a knockoff product of the Newman stuff and it appears are simply calling it "Sefar Roller Mesh" it appears. I doubt there is any real connection in product. And, yes, it would make no sense to put a product like Newman Roller Mesh into a non-retenionable scenario.
So how tight do these panel frames go?
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I have six 20x24 Panel/Trax frames. I'm not a huge fan. I like the fact that they're not statics, but the tension on them just isn't all that great. My prints have been looking okay and I don't really do high detailed stuff anyway, but anything over 160 mesh seems to tear way to easily along the edges of the frame. I suppose I should be using newman roller tape or something to protect the edges, but I didn't even mishandle the frames and they started to tear during a job I was printing. Tension seems to settle in the 15-16 newton area. Not an ideal number. I tried double rolling one of my 160 panels for kicks, after I stretched 3 sides the tension was at 30n, then I popped the panel on the final side lol.. I saw that coming. It was nice to briefly feel what a 30n screen feels like though. I can only imagine how much of a joy it is to print on.
Anyway, I guess the good would be that if you don't have a lot of space or don't want to stock a bunch of screens in each mesh type, you can just buy a few of these and stretch the mesh you need for that particular job. I don't plan on buying anymore. I'll probably just use them for simple jobs and throw 110 mesh on all of them since that seems to be the most durable. I'm going to invest in a few EZ frames. I've been dying to get my hands on them.
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I have six 20x24 Panel/Trax frames. I'm not a huge fan. I like the fact that they're not statics, but the tension on them just isn't all that great. My prints have been looking okay and I don't really do high detailed stuff anyway, but anything over 160 mesh seems to tear way to easily along the edges of the frame. I suppose I should be using newman roller tape or something to protect the edges, but I didn't even mishandle the frames and they started to tear during a job I was printing. Tension seems to settle in the 15-16 newton area. Not an ideal number. I tried double rolling one of my 160 panels for kicks, after I stretched 3 sides the tension was at 30n, then I popped the panel on the final side lol.. I saw that coming. It was nice to briefly feel what a 30n screen feels like though. I can only imagine how much of a joy it is to print on.
Anyway, I guess the good would be that if you don't have a lot of space or don't want to stock a bunch of screens in each mesh type, you can just buy a few of these and stretch the mesh you need for that particular job. I don't plan on buying anymore. I'll probably just use them for simple jobs and throw 110 mesh on all of them since that seems to be the most durable. I'm going to invest in a few EZ frames. I've been dying to get my hands on them.
I find the 110's stabilize in the mid 20s for the most part. But it is inconsistent, some tension drop to the teens immediately and some stabilize just fine. Tensions are probably different between frame sizes.
For the life of me I cannot figure out why the small holes appear all along the edges. It's smooth along them edges yet small holes appear. I tried different taping techniques but it still happens, it's obviously an issue where the mesh touchs the frame it self, a spot that cannot be taped. My best guess is the powder coating is breaking down and producing tiny burrs, that's one of the issues with these frames and that's the powder coating.
Plus out of fifty several are warped, they didn't,t come that way so all I can assume is stress from the mesh and stress from the printing causes some to warp.
I never tried double rolling but of I do I will sit the panels out in the baking sun first with the hope they have some stretch in them from being heated who knows.
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It seems to me, that though counter-intuitive, that screens tighten up in the heat
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I dunno... post exposure washout, we subject our screens to finish drying outside in this hot August sun. No poblems with busting or not registering on press. But watch out, those rollers will burn your hands when transporting them back in to the shop.
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So, here's an assignment for someone with a meter. Measure the same screen at hugely different temps and see if there is a significant difference. Heck, you can even use a non-contact thermometer to read the temperature of the mesh itself.
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Years ago when I worked for a screen making company I remember the head guy always saying to allow the bolts of mesh to a climate in the temp controlled part of the shop. I just assume the mesh would be more elastic when hot.
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I think I remember, back when I was a mere tad doing time in a funky old shop, funky old frames put on top of the dryer (yeah, it was funky too) to tighten them up. I assume that the mesh was shrinking.
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Heat causes expansion in everything I know of though.
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I am not thinking about expansion or contraction at all just pliability.
Andy may be right tho heat does cause plastics to shrink, like the plastic for drafty windows when hit with a blow dryer it shrinks up to a nice taut sheet.
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Or that expensive rayon jersey with the multi-color cad cut design! ;D
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Does it not expand before it contracts?
It expands before it gets damaged and starts to shrink... I think.
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Like I said before. I don't have all of the answers.
Try it tomorrow morning. Get a temp and tension check on a screen when it's still reasonably cool, stick it on top of your dryer for a few hours or send it down with the belt going pretty fast and get that temp on it up 30 or 40 degrees and get another tension reading. I'm as interested as you in the results.
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Gilli, what happens to you when you go in the cold pool. IT shrinks!!!
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Gilli, what happens to you when you go in the cold pool. IT shrinks!!!
OMG that has me laughing my arse off!
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here's the deal with panel frames. If you double roll the mesh, you only do one side, not all 4. That will bring them up into the high teens. You can only double roll after you printed on them a few times or it will bust. at first tension, they are like Mike said in the mid teens. The main issues we have is the powder coating is coming off and turning into a real rough almost sandpaper type finish. When stretching a panel, we can get all the way to the end of the frame and the locking bar starts to do a 90 degree turn up, not sliding down and locking into position. we ripped about 3 305's the other day trying to get one frame to work. The tiny holes, we get those too. I believe they are pressure points put on the frame inside the frame holders on the press. we don't use frame tape and panels, so I think that's the issue there.
I am / have been slowly switching to rollers, it's a little more work but it's night and day as far as a print goes. I wish I would have listened to Sam and went with them sooner.
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Just for an FYI I tried the incorrect sefar roller panels in our standard frames and it will not work. The locking strip is different and will not engage the tracks on the standard frames correctly.
Becareful in the future and make sure you order the right frames keeping in my they have new panels for their rollers.
Peter i will get in contact with your guy and get these panels replaced with the right ones.
Thanks