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Heat Seal - Heat Press - Whatever you want to call it! => General Heat Seal => Topic started by: ScreenPrinter123 on October 26, 2012, 12:20:34 PM
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So I have a customer who wants to do a 2 color scheme with numbers on front and back and the name of the school on the front in the same 2 color scheme. Is it possible to apply vinyl in this two color scheme attached without the green sitting on top of the white but literally butting up to the white and sitting on top of the shirt. The two issues I see are:
(1) If I heat press the white first, will it shrink and therefore the green won't butt up but overlap the white?
(2) How time consuming will it be to line up the green inside of the white to make it look "perfect"?
Save me, someone, from my miserific quagmire...
I am guessing this would be unquestionably easier with a 2 color screen printing numbering system? I will need to attempt the above for this job (butting up vinyl), but does anyone recommend a 2 color system that doesn't suck, but is user friendly to where I won't have the buyer's regret of "I should've paid $500 more for the better numbering system" 1 week after using it?
Thanks
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Forgot to attach the image in my first post!
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I use Siser Easy Weed.....My 1st press is 1 second to avoid shrinkage.....You need to do a bit of a trap on the 2nd layer....1/16" of an inch if you are good.....Lining up 2 layers is quick once you have some experience......Why not use pre-printed numbers?....Or is your colour combination not available?
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Like Royster, I set it up much like a screen print with a little trap. Even as much as 1/8th inch does not look bad with some designs with most of the films.
Some shirts shrink more than others, so I pre heat to pre shrink.
I also sometimes assemble the layers before pressing, but that gets pretty tough with most sticky backing films
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Eco-Film - Two color application (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8zAOf7Hmot4#ws)
Hope it helps
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That method is the easiest, but stacks. 123 specifically is trying to eliminate overlap.
Stahls also sells their die cuts (which I already told you are far cheaper than roll film) as backgrounds and foregrounds for this method
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Did he say he didn't want to "stack"?
That's how I have always done it... just like int he vid that Dennis posted.
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Yeah, the customer is cognizant of the two methods (stack vs non-stack) and prefers the non-stack because he's mentioned that the top layer, when stacked, has always peeled off from his other printer whom they seem to be shying away from now. He's wanting all vinyl to be grabbing on the shirt to ensure a stronger grab by the vinyl adhesive.
At any rate, I've never done 2 color vinyl application before like this, so I don't know if this peeling off of the top layer via the "stacking method" is typical and to be expected after a year or so, or if there was a deficiency in the method that was employed by the other printer/or maybe even poor quality vinyl? We typically use Easi Weed and Thermo Flex plus and on the Thermo Flex instruction page, they actually show the process of doing the vinyl in two colors like this but they stack it -- so it leads me to think, possibly, the other printer has a deficiency in his method - don't know?
As far as pre-printed numbers (I'm guessing you mean plastisol prints on transfer paper?), I've never looked into it (well, we did about 3 years ago, but I don't remember squat about it) or tried it -- I know the green color is going to have to be pretty close, so that is imperative if we were to transfer plastisol prints. Whom do you recommend for this Royster?
Frog, do you know off hand if Stahls' background/foregrounds "knocks out" the foreground color in the background vinyl or is it the stack method?
Thanks guys.
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Ok, I'm following now.
Just an FYI, we have a layered shirt that is worn almost weekly by my brother-in-law and it's held up for 2 years + now.
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Have a plastisol two color transfers made. Try FM expressions in NJ. They have done PMS matches for us in the past. If you lay out the sheet right they can be very cost effective and usually 3 or 4 day turn around.
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Binkspot, what's opacity like for lighter colors going on darker colors when doing plastisol transfer sheets, as this will be the case (royal 100% polyester shirts with white and lime green ink)? And I'm guessing you have to specify what material the garment is that you'll be transferring to so the appropriate polyester ink will be used by them?
Thanks.
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We have used white transfers on black garments with no issues and usually run white on royal 100% poly Euro style numbers (local soccer club colors, did some this morning). Call them up, they will walk you through exactly what you need. There is a small up charge I believe for the poly but no biggie. They will come with the directions (320 for 10 seconds, hot peal) for applying. Its pretty straight forward.
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Frog, do you know off hand if Stahls' background/foregrounds "knocks out" the foreground color in the background vinyl or is it the stack method?
Thanks guys.
No, the Stahls backgrounds are just big fat versions of their foreground bretheren.
Adhesion is no problem (with the correct materials) it's just that stacking numbers is the faster, easier, thicker, clunkier, less sophisticated method.
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I mostly use FM Expressions but your colour combo will be a problem.....So you might have to check Transfer Express.......
As far as 2 layers of vinyl.....I mostly use Siser Easy Weed and peeling is not a problem.....
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I mostly use FM Expressions but your colour combo will be a problem.....So you might have to check Transfer Express.......
As far as 2 layers of vinyl.....I mostly use Siser Easy Weed and peeling is not a problem.....
Just curious, what issue would be a problem? They have done similar jobs black/white and red/white for us in the past. Not trying to stir the pot just curious.
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The only problem of adhesion I ever came across (but as you read on, you will see it wasn't after all) was stacking on top of metallics.
I was running some expensive one-off fitness suits promoting a coconut water that required many different color combinations.
Specialty Materials Thermo Flex instructions warn to not use metallics in multi color designs
I assumed that this really only meant to not stack it on top (which I was planning) since all colors use the same adhesive, and only the top material changes.
A tech there took the time to cut a design and try it both ways, wash it, and report back! Wow, I thought.
An hour later, he called back to report, that yes, I could stack silver on black, and also, damned if it didn't work the other way around as well! He thanked me for helping him learn something new!
As I said, that company is great for tech support. Siser could learn a lot!
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I mostly use FM Expressions but your colour combo will be a problem.....So you might have to check Transfer Express.......
As far as 2 layers of vinyl.....I mostly use Siser Easy Weed and peeling is not a problem.....
Just curious, what issue would be a problem? They have done similar jobs black/white and red/white for us in the past. Not trying to stir the pot just curious.
I've never used them, but FM Expressions transfers are plastisol based so I assume that there can be some bleeding issues less likely with vinyl and polypropylene films.
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Lime Green is not a very standard colour.....
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I think I'm just going to buckle and go with Vastex's numberings system since we have a V2000. Do any of you have any experience -- pros and cons -- let me have it -- want to know. I'll obviously be going with the 2 color system, but pretty much plan on just getting the screens blank -- will coat and shoot out the #'s myself if this client needs a specific font to match the #'s and just make those our standard screens.
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I think I'm just going to buckle and go with Vastex's numberings system since we have a V2000. Do any of you have any experience -- pros and cons -- let me have it -- want to know. I'll obviously be going with the 2 color system, but pretty much plan on just getting the screens blank -- will coat and shoot out the #'s myself if this client needs a specific font to match the #'s and just make those our standard screens.
I'd recommend going that route with the screens as well. I saw them first hand from the factory and they have practically ZERO EOM. I was quite disappointed.
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Yes, we have had ours for over two years now. Have printed a boat load of numbers with it. Just a few pointers when using it.
All the number sizes can be placed on a std 23 x 31 except the 8" set which if I remember correctly (home now) are on a 25 x 33.
We use 81 mesh with ours.
I have attached 1/8" shims to the bottom of the screens using blue block out tape. I have found if the shims are not in place you will sometimes get a ghost image from the number next to the one you are printing. The shims will prevent this and if they get ink on them easy to wipe off instead of wiping the whole screen.
It helps to flash between two digit numbers, helps prevent getting ink on the bottom of the screen and or shims.
The first few times will be a pia to reg. Once you figure it out its pretty simple.
Getting used to which notch to use for which number placement takes a few tries. I will usually put some painters tape at the reference point for easy location.
It is accurate, once it drops into the appropriate notch your good to go.
It is nice to be able to PMS match.
Get the set of films to keep on hand so you can burn as necessary.
Two color numbers are easy once it is in reg.