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screen printing => Ink and Chemicals => Topic started by: ZooCity on June 13, 2013, 04:42:14 PM
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What are you using?
Just found out that WFX Super Opaques are not bleed resistant which leaves Performance or the newer, slightly different Top Score inks/bases as the only option to do a PFP on 50/50s from them. For PFP applications we typically mix a max pigment load with the appropriate base but bleed resistance isn't addressed that way unless we reach for the Performance base and frankly I don't prefer the finish of that ink or the weird smell.
Kinda makes me miss QCMs XOLB line. I guess we could just UB everything like this but it's often more cost effective to our clients to charge an extra $0.25 per pc for PFP than it is to add a UB color so I'd like to continue offering PFP. Setup is faster too I suppose, even though it does require an additional revolution on the auto.
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Need to bump this to the top. I have been on the search for this as well. And even non lo bleed. I just tried some Rutland HO and it really did not work to well.
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Trying Rutland super poly white tomorrow. 80 per gal at tubelite. Performance white went up to 125 a gal, that's rediculous.
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Trying Rutland super poly white tomorrow. 80 per gal at tubelite. Performance white went up to 125 a gal, that's rediculous.
I like the Rutland Poly, really smooth and not to bad in the smell department.
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Rutland's super poly is a really good product for 100% and the street fighter low bleed works well and is very affordable. Still need to test your product though. Dye migration can be a real challenge with some brands. With the super poly it takes seven or eight test prints to get the ink moving well.
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Why not just go back to QCM XOLB?
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Is the XOLB super shiny when PFP on darks?
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I've found with XOLB the gloss level is really more a factor of how it's printed, With higher mesh counts and PFP, or colors over a white base, it's not that shiny. If you print a 109 mesh base and the a 109 top color or even a 156, then, yeah, it's probably gonna be glossy.
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The last couple gallons of Rutland Super Poly have had significant puff additive and it's causing problems. It does work and blocks any dye migration that could happen but I can't deal with that much puff. I tested some prints last week and the super poly was puffing up about 75 microns over regular inks.
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We have found the blowing agent in those super poly's if used alone and
with top colors leave pock marks or looking under magnification look
like little volcanoes breaking through surface.
A medium raise like Wilflex Extreme (less puff than Quick) with a H/F/H-156 mesh
then top colors works very nice. It can also work alone this way if dryer is tuned in and not too hot.
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Alan, have you tried adding some base to it, like the halftone base you use in your normal mixes, maybe that takes down the puff a little? Just curious. I used to do that with Wilflex's normal polly white, made it easier to work with, not as much height in the image and still blocked the bleed really well. I used just normal curable reducer though, but still did the trick. I'm about to run a few hundred forrest green st350l's using the Super Poly white Rutland, I guess I'll see what ya'll are talking about lol
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I'll take a blowing agent over hydrogen peroxide in my Poly ink any day. Bleaching agent bit me bad on a big order last year as it ghosted really bad right through the other side of the shirt. You can take the puff out of a poly white by cutting with a regular white and dial it in to your needs, or at least that's what we found.
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I've cut the poly with a standard low bleed ink before but when we used it all up I never made any more. I'm no stranger to modifying the inks, especially our white and I'll start working on a formula if I can't find a poly white that doesn't puff so bad. My first choice is to find a more ejectable poly white with great bleed resistance and no puff, but that's asking a lot so I can see me mixing up our own special poly white.
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Ok, so we ran these. These forrest green ST350's are big time bleeders and the super poly non phthalate white from Rutland was nice. Nice cure, I didn't really see much "raise" from puff in it, I didn't modify it either. I wonder if they are working on their forumulas. Of course I didn't look through a microscope at it, but it looks the same as when it's wet. Now, maybe the heat from the flash on the first coat activates the puff in it and that's why it looks the same at both sides of the dryer, but it wasn't bad at all. We are about to do a run of hoodies and I'm using this as an underbase for 2 top coats of Wilflex epic custom mixes. I'll see if there is any negative effects on this run. Also, the finish was a nice matte, no gloss to it, which is nice!
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How about low bleed high opacity colors? It looks like QCM is the only one with such an animal in a variety of colors. Or are there any others?
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I think we've split this up into two camps of ink:
Low bleed - for blends, etc.
Poly - for 100% poly that needs low cure temp, additional stretch properties and big time dye blocking.
For us poly is easy- WFX performance all the way. I think it really is as good as it gets for poly ink.
What I would love to see is WFX make a series of "Quick" spot colors and/or a "Quick" base. I have no idea if it's possible to formulate other colors than white with the quick recipe but man, Epic Quick White is the easiest ink to print in the whole shop. Super consistent and works great every time on everything we print it on. I think the ability to get spots with quick's characteristics would be the end all for a regular low bleed series of plastisol inks. They would cost too much for most shops but I'd buy 'em for sure.
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Lancer/Excalibur has low bleed colors and I've tried the red on 100% poly black shirts and it did ok. Not as good as I'd hoped but it held up enough. It is specifically made for this type of printing and I thought it would do better than it did but the customer was happy with them but probably because I warned them and tried to sway them in a different direction. Their logo is so small there is no way we can underbase it with a poly white so it's print the red, flash, red again.
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How about low bleed high opacity colors? It looks like QCM is the only one with such an animal in a variety of colors. Or are there any others?
Other ink manufacturers do offer HOLB colors as well. Wilflex has the TOP SCORE colors. We have all those in inventory in Atlanta. Union makes a line of LB colors as well - I think they call it Poly Athletic or something.
Most tee printers use low bleed underbases and standard colors on top. The need for BR colors really is for manual numbering printers where there is not way to underbase.
Rob
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Xenon mustang anyone try that? I just saw an ad for it online.
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Xenon horse anyone try that? I just saw an ad for it online.
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Brad (MK162) and I did some testing with this. Cures at 258 degrees and is safe on bleeding up to 320 degrees. I would recommend setting your dryer for around 260 degree cure. It is a gloss finish but can be made matte if so desired. It has its own reducer as well. Call me for a price.
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We just found out today that Wilflex Epic Top Score low bleed ink is the best I have and the easiest low bleed ink I have ever used in my 30 years of printing. Great opacity, absolutly no bleed, great stretch, very easy to use. I highly recommend it
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We just found out today that Wilflex Epic Top Score low bleed ink is the best I have and the easiest low bleed ink I have ever used in my 30 years of printing. Great opacity, absolutly no bleed, great stretch, very easy to use. I highly recommend it
What is the difference between this one and Quick White? Characteristics wise?
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We just found out today that Wilflex Epic Top Score low bleed ink is the best I have and the easiest low bleed ink I have ever used in my 30 years of printing. Great opacity, absolutly no bleed, great stretch, very easy to use. I highly recommend it
What is the difference between this one and Quick White? Characteristics wise?
Top a Score is a complete LB line - colors and white. They are designed for 100% polyester fabrics. Very bleed resistant.
Quick white is a good BR white for 50/50 blends, but NOT 100% poly.
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Just tried some QCM XOLB purple on some black 50/50 tees and hoodies and was quite pleased for a pfp on a 110 mesh coated 3/1. And for only about $42 a gallon I think we have a winner.